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Louisville, KY
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State: PA & NJ
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Louisville, KY
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Missing Lintel?
[#3] Posted: 12/19/2010 - 4:44:09 PM |  |  |
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So you run a piece of re-bar through the brick to hold it into place while the mortar sets? I'm assuming this is only allowed in this situation, meaning not bearing any more weight than it's own.
I'll bet your right Bill. Total of 6 windows, all the soldiers waved at you as you walked by. What did they REALLY do? Plywood support while the mortar set?
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ABI Home Services
Louisville KY Home Inspector
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Ashland, VA
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 Missing Lintel?
[#4] Posted: 12/19/2010 - 9:24:04 PM | | |
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Quote: Originally posted by Bill KibbelLooking at the pic, it's probably not installed like this: Click to View
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Interesting detail... The rendering really appears to show a typical 10" or 12" concrete block, given away by the slot in the middle, which permits a mason to easily cut the unit into half units with a brick hammer or chisel. Yet, the text identifies it as a brick. I never ran across a brick with such a generous core.
That is indeed a lame installation. Fortunately, it's just the one soldier course and it's not structural. It appears that, if one pulls the frieze board, the soldier will fall right out of the wall. Nice! I fear there are no true masons left....
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Louisville, KY
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Missing Lintel?
[#5] Posted: 12/20/2010 - 03:45:43 AM | | |
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Another thought I had was the windows are nail flange style and where installed first. The brick was then installed on top of the window frame, using it as a shelf.... just a WAG though.
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ABI Home Services
Louisville KY Home Inspector
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Lexington, KY
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Missing Lintel?
[#6] Posted: 12/20/2010 - 04:17:09 AM | | |
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I see it all the time, Ben. The reasons why are plain ol' ineptitude and laziness.
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Ashland, VA
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Collins, NY
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Missing Lintel?
[#8] Posted: 12/20/2010 - 07:30:23 AM | | |
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I'm curious, is this soldier a result of modern truss design? Before 'energy trusses' the frieze would have been at the top of the window and with rafters the soffit would rest atop the brickmold, there would be no soldier course.
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Tom
http://clearcreekhomeinspection.com/
Life is tough enough as it is, it's tougher when your stupid. Don't do stupid things.
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Ashland, VA
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Lafayette, Louisiana
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Missing Lintel?
[#10] Posted: 12/20/2010 - 08:09:51 AM | | |
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Quote: Originally posted by mgbinspectQuote: Originally posted by Tom Raymond
I'm curious, is this soldier a result of modern truss design? Before 'energy trusses' the frieze would have been at the top of the window and with rafters the soffit would rest atop the brickmold, there would be no soldier course.
Hmm... as far back as I can remember, there is always about six to seven inches between the top of the window and the bottom of the frieze board, which acommodated a soldier or jack arch nicely. That seems to work about right with the fact that windows tend to be about twelve to fourteen inches down from the ceiling.
Allowing for regional differences...the top of windows and doors are generally at 7'. With 8' ceilings, this puts the bottom of the ceiling joists at 97" from the subfloor. If the rafters sit on top of the walls, alongside the joists, the elevation of the structural frieze board depends on the pitch of the roof and the width of the overhang. An 18" overhang at a 6/12 pitch is a 9" drop. Add to that the height of the plumb cut on the bird's mouth and you have only 2 1/2" left which is the measurement from the frieze to the window RO.
Lots of variations and details on that within a given region, but that's a common scenario in my area, including my own house.
Marc
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Ashland, VA
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Missing Lintel?
[#11] Posted: 12/20/2010 - 08:14:26 AM | | |
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Quote: Originally posted by MarcQuote: Originally posted by mgbinspectQuote: Originally posted by Tom Raymond
I'm curious, is this soldier a result of modern truss design? Before 'energy trusses' the frieze would have been at the top of the window and with rafters the soffit would rest atop the brickmold, there would be no soldier course.
Hmm... as far back as I can remember, there is always about six to seven inches between the top of the window and the bottom of the frieze board, which acommodated a soldier or jack arch nicely. That seems to work about right with the fact that windows tend to be about twelve to fourteen inches down from the ceiling. Allowing for regional differences...the top of windows and doors are generally at 7'. With 8' ceilings, this puts the bottom of the ceiling joists at 97" from the subfloor. If the rafters sit on top of the walls, alongside the joists, the elevation of the structural frieze board depends on the pitch of the roof and the width of the overhang. An 18" overhang at a 6/12 pitch is a 9" drop. Add to that the height of the plumb cut on the bird's mouth and you have only 2 1/2" left which is the measurement from the frieze to the window RO. Lots of variations and details on that within a given region, but that's a common scenario in my area, including my own house. Marc
Indeed, and Richmond being of the religion of the Colonial Williamsburg Replica, the scenario I descibed prevails here - limited overhang.
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Collins, NY
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Missing Lintel?
[#12] Posted: 12/20/2010 - 08:30:57 AM | | |
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That's what I see here,Marc, and the reason for my question. A modern truss extends a 6" bottom chord to the exterior shifting the overhang upwards, and if we delete the brickmold like the pics in this thread, that leaves 8" for a soldier course. Gee, aren't bricks usually 8"?
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Tom
http://clearcreekhomeinspection.com/
Life is tough enough as it is, it's tougher when your stupid. Don't do stupid things.
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Lafayette, Louisiana
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Louisville, KY
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Missing Lintel?
[#14] Posted: 12/20/2010 - 12:26:58 PM | | |
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Not to re-hi-jack the thread ;) What would you chaps write up about said missing lintel? I took the easy way out on this one and called for a mason, but what would you say?
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ABI Home Services
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Ashland, VA
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Missing Lintel?
[#15] Posted: 12/20/2010 - 12:40:35 PM | | |
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Me personally, I'd disclose it as an unconventional brick veneer installation - not a structural issue - just a really lousy veneer job. As long as the frieze isn't remover, the brick's not going anywhere, and since it (the brick) bears no weight, repairs or modifications aren't paramount and will become more of an eye-sore than the existing condition.
It's unfortunate, but not a threat to structure or safety concern.
(Maybe when I see a bigger picture of it than on my phone, I might change my mind about the threat to safety)
In short, I'd fully disclose it as what it is: a cosmetic mess; an improper use of materials; a bad detail; all pretty much cosmetic.
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Lexington, KY
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Missing Lintel?
[#16] Posted: 12/20/2010 - 1:26:26 PM | | |
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| Quote: Originally posted by mgbinspect
Me personally, I'd disclose it as an unconventional brick veneer installation - not a structural issue - just a really lousy veneer job. As long as the frieze isn't remover, the brick's not going anywhere, and since it (the brick) bears no weight, repairs or modifications aren't paramount and will become more of an eye-sore than the existing condition.
It's unfortunate, but not a threat to structure or safety concern.
(Maybe when I see a bigger picture of it than on my phone, I might change my mind about the threat to safety)
In short, I'd fully disclose it as what it is: a cosmetic mess; an improper use of materials; a bad detail; all pretty much cosmetic.
Well, but I see this mistake fairly often, Mike, and lots of times the bricks are loose and can be moved by hand. Look at the upper/right corner of Ben's photo. The mortar's cracked and I'll bet the brick is loose. I ALWAYS say this should be repaired.
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Ashland, VA
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Missing Lintel?
[#17] Posted: 12/20/2010 - 1:42:04 PM | | |
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Quote: Originally posted by BainQuote: Originally posted by mgbinspect
Me personally, I'd disclose it as an unconventional brick veneer installation - not a structural issue - just a really lousy veneer job. As long as the frieze isn't remover, the brick's not going anywhere, and since it (the brick) bears no weight, repairs or modifications aren't paramount and will become more of an eye-sore than the existing condition.
It's unfortunate, but not a threat to structure or safety concern.
(Maybe when I see a bigger picture of it than on my phone, I might change my mind about the threat to safety)
In short, I'd fully disclose it as what it is: a cosmetic mess; an improper use of materials; a bad detail; all pretty much cosmetic.
Well, but I see this mistake fairly often, Mike, and lots of times the bricks are loose and can be moved by hand. Look at the upper/right corner of Ben's photo. The mortar's cracked and I'll bet the brick is loose. I ALWAYS say this should be repaired.
Agreed. If it's a danger, that changes everything. I'm just not a "it's wrong fix it guy." when it comes to masonry, that can land you in the immortal home inspector category, as folks say, "My God! What happened to your brickwork?" and the owner responds, "This was my home inspector's idea of a necessary repair." ... Oops...
In ALL situations similar to this one (cosmetic more than a real problem), I begin with a verbal discussion, like my previous post - essentially "it is what it is". Then, after being the voice of education and reason, I ask my client, "Where do you wish to go with this?" I honor my client's desire in cases like this.
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Pearland, Texas
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Missing Lintel?
[#18] Posted: 12/26/2010 - 7:09:35 PM | | |
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I have seen similar situations with no lintel or decayed metal lintels, all resulting if sagging as seen in your photo.
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Robert Welch
ATEX Inspects
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Evergreen Park (Chicago), IL
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Missing Lintel?
[#19] Posted: 12/27/2010 - 5:05:28 PM | | |
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This is new construction. There may be an unsupported lintel here or maybe no lintel at all. The soldiers may be a RBM lintel as in Bill K's diagram or maybe not. And then a sweet caulk job on top of it all.
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Mike Lamb
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Ashland, VA
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