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Evergreen Park (Chicago), IL
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State: PA & NJ
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Lafayette, Louisiana
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 Shed Dormer Framing
[#3] Posted: 05/12/2012 - 2:57:51 PM |  |  |
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Is that the whole story? How does the other end of the rafters look?
Marc
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Evergreen Park (Chicago), IL
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Shed Dormer Framing
[#4] Posted: 05/12/2012 - 4:42:57 PM | | |
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There was no framing failure/sagging at all anywhere. I would think the nails in those scabs would be under some stress yet 14 years with no problems also says alot. We have had some pretty good snowfalls in the last 14 years.
I don't like to call out repairs for things that have withstood the test of time. Maybe 14 years is not enough to apply that model.
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Mike Lamb
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Little Rock, AR
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Shed Dormer Framing
[#5] Posted: 05/12/2012 - 5:40:32 PM | | |
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Here's my take: the horizontal run of the rafters looks to be only about 8 feet or so, based on my quick attempt to scale the first photo.
You say that only three nails were used to fasten the scab. If that is referring to the nails at the ridge I've got no problem with it. IF done properly, that is. (Toenails placed too close to the end of the scab don't count since they don't hold much.) If that 3 nail figure refers to the number of nails attaching the scab to the rafter, it would be a real good idea to add more nails there.
Even if it has withstood the snow load of a dozen or more winters, next year could bring a far heavier storm.
And why no collar ties?
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Kevin
"Politicians are interested in people. Not that it is always a virtue; fleas are interested in dogs." P.J. O'Rourke
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Chicago, IL
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Shed Dormer Framing
[#6] Posted: 05/12/2012 - 8:02:10 PM | | |
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Pretty much the standard "popup", or "lift dormer"; whack out the form in the roof line, jack up the existing rafters, brace it together as best one can, nail it. There's about a quarter million of these things in Chicagoland. This one actually looks pretty nice, because at least it has a little eave overhang to minimize the ice dam backup into the wall.
They all ice dam like a 1950's icebox, and are generally gnarly pieces of crap, but they're everywhere.
Nothing bad beyond ice dams ever happens, other than the frontal assault on aesthetic sensibility.
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Kurt in Chicago
"If I smell it, it goes in the report".............Phillip Smith...2012
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Victoria, British Columbia
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Shed Dormer Framing
[#7] Posted: 05/13/2012 - 08:31:06 AM | | |
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How about adding some collar ties?
They need to keep the tips of the original rafters tight against the ridge board and to keep the dormer wall from tipping out. Maybe there's a Simpson strap for that. But collar ties would help a lot, IMO.
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Chicago, IL
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Shed Dormer Framing
[#8] Posted: 05/13/2012 - 08:44:25 AM | | |
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With all respect due those thinking this is a pile of crap, because it is, nothing is going to happen because there's no collar ties.
I don't condone crap unless I've got a pretty good basis for it. There's literally hundreds of thousands of these ugly piles all over Chicago. They're poorly assembled, lousy or no insulation, ugly, etc., etc., but they don't fall down, up, or sideways.
They ice dam, and they're ugly. That's it. If it makes anyone feel better, strap some Simpson gadgets in and around the messier areas, if you can even reach them. If not, point it out in the report, make the usual recommendations that no one is ever going to do, and move on.
This is Chicago. It isn't somewhere else. We call shed dormers "popups", or "lifts", they're everywhere, I have tried to inform people they are shed dormers and need IWS and good carpentry but no one cares, and largely, neither do I. It's a Chicago thing one gets used to.
They just sit there being ugly.
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Kurt in Chicago
"If I smell it, it goes in the report".............Phillip Smith...2012
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Victoria, British Columbia
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Shed Dormer Framing
[#9] Posted: 05/13/2012 - 12:26:35 PM | | |
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| Quote: Originally posted by kurt
With all respect due those thinking this is a pile of crap, because it is, nothing is going to happen because there's no collar ties.
I don't condone crap unless I've got a pretty good basis for it. There's literally hundreds of thousands of these ugly piles all over Chicago. They're poorly assembled, lousy or no insulation, ugly, etc., etc., but they don't fall down, up, or sideways.
They ice dam, and they're ugly. That's it. If it makes anyone feel better, strap some Simpson gadgets in and around the messier areas, if you can even reach them. If not, point it out in the report, make the usual recommendations that no one is ever going to do, and move on.
This is Chicago. It isn't somewhere else. We call shed dormers "popups", or "lifts", they're everywhere, I have tried to inform people they are shed dormers and need IWS and good carpentry but no one cares, and largely, neither do I. It's a Chicago thing one gets used to.
They just sit there being ugly.
Feeling somewhat jaded, are we? 
I get your point. I used to build tree forts out of crap lumber and bent nails. They were good, and the only time the floor fell out from under one of them, was when a tree fell and hit the cantilevered porch.
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Chicago, IL
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Shed Dormer Framing
[#10] Posted: 05/14/2012 - 06:40:15 AM | | |
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Yeah, pretty much. Some stuff just is the way it always will be.
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Kurt in Chicago
"If I smell it, it goes in the report".............Phillip Smith...2012
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Comer, GA
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Shed Dormer Framing
[#11] Posted: 05/14/2012 - 06:44:47 AM | | |
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No engineer here, but my common sense carpenter's head says bracing with sheathing of those ends is what you would want to resist the thrust from the opposite rafters.
Not to mention hoping they beefed up the former ceiling joists which now are floor joists.
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Collins, NY
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Shed Dormer Framing
[#12] Posted: 05/14/2012 - 10:14:18 AM | | |
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There's hundreds of these here too, in every post war development in the Buffalo 'burbs. Nearly every one of them is wrong, and they're all still standing.
Quote: ...other than the frontal assault on aesthetic sensibility.
I know exactly what your talking about, but as additions go this one doesn't look too bad.
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Tom
http://clearcreekhomeinspection.com/
Life is tough enough as it is, it's tougher when your stupid. Don't do stupid things.
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