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Ashland, VA
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Comer, GA
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#2] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 10:54:18 AM |  |  |
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mg,
Looks like they bought the longest piece of wood on the lumber yard and tried to stretch it.
Bottom of flight looks to lack by lots the minimum required landing in direction of travel of 36".
The list of fixit options looks really short here. Maybe a firehall brass pole with a matress at the bottom?
With a stair like that I bet the rest of the framing reflects the same skill level.
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Ashland, VA
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#3] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 10:58:10 AM | | |
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Actually, the framing throughout the house is pretty good. Unfortunately, I suppose the architect miss-calculated the baclony depth needed. The only remedy possible is to add mor depth to either the second of third floor hallways to accomodate the stairway.
The stairways was constructed for this use. It has a double 2 x stringer and was pricey I'm sure.
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Staten Island, New York
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#4] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 4:04:40 PM | | |
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Mike,
I hope you were wearing a parachute!
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Steven Turetsky, UID#16000002314
Comprehensive Home & Building Inspections
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Staten Island, Manhattan, Brooklyn, Queens, Bronx, Long Island, Westchester
"The great aim of education is not knowledge, but action".
Herbert Spencer 1830-1903 |
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Ashland, VA
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#5] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 4:16:21 PM | | |
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It's a long way down and it feels it, as you ascend without a railing. Kinda reminded me of my masonry days on scaffolds without railings. It gives new meaning to the phrase "presence of mind."
My younger brother, who was also a mason, had the pleasure of constructing an industrial smoke stack in Baltimore, Maryland. That's actually about the only masonry task that I never got to do and I was pretty envious. (the brat!) An ever increasing view every day for hundreds of feet.
They actually used to use a plumb bob as a guide to keep smoke stacks straight and plumb. Now, they use lasers.
It's a pretty fascinating process. Yesterday's work becomes today's work platform support. No scaffold needed. Framing for each new work platform is actually set on the inside wythe of the brickwork and layed into the smoke stack. It's all stripped out on the way back down and the interior brick work patched. The brick is layed overhand from the inside. Materials are hoisted up through the center of the chimney.
In fact, that's how colonial masons installed brick on most of the very old houses you see. A pole was set away from the building and framing lay ed into the masonry and lashed to the pole. That was early American scaffolding.
Hmmm... How'd I get on that tangent? Oh yeah, heights. 
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Springfield, NJ
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 A Stairway To Heaven?
[#6] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 6:15:18 PM | | |
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Quote: Originally posted by mgbinspectIt's a long way down and it feels it, as you ascend without a railing. Kinda reminded me of my masonry days on scaffolds without railings. It gives new meaning to the phrase "presence of mind." My younger brother, who was also a mason, had the pleasure of constructing an industrial smoke stack in Baltimore, Maryland. That's actually about the only masonry task that I never got to do and I was pretty envious. (the brat!) An ever increasing view every day for hundreds of feet. They actually used to use a plumb bob as a guide to keep smoke stacks straight and plumb. Now, they use lasers. It's a pretty fascinating process. Yesterday's work becomes today's work platform support. No scaffold needed. Framing for each new work platform is actually set on the inside wythe of the brickwork and layed into the smoke stack. It's all stripped out on the way back down and the interior brick work patched. The brick is layed overhand from the inside. Materials are hoisted up through the center of the chimney. In fact, that's how colonial masons installed brick on most of the very old houses you see. A pole was set away from the building and framing lay ed into the masonry and lashed to the pole. That was early American scaffolding. Hmmm... How'd I get on that tangent? Oh yeah, heights.
Sorry for th drift but you started it 
My Grandfather was a demolition contractor and he told me stories of how he used to demo those smoke stacks. He would have guys remove some bricks at the bottom and replace them with wood blocking. He would continue this until a bunch of the bricks were replaced with blocking on one bottom side. They would soak the wood with kerosene and light the wood on fire and run. When the wood burned enough, the stack would fall.
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Ashland, VA
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#7] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 7:05:13 PM | | |
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Interesting! Pre-strategic dynamite days. Well, we better get back on track before we get beat up. 
Just kidding, Mike... You do a fantastic job!
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#8] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 7:39:57 PM | | |
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MGB wrote: "In fact, that's how colonial masons installed brick on most of the very old houses you see. A pole was set away from the building and framing layed into the masonry and lashed to the pole. That was early American scaffolding."
That method of scaffolding goes back a ways before early America. Here is a 13th century barn with the "putlog holes".
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| Bill Kibbel, Historic & Commercial Building Inspections - Old House Resources |
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Ashland, VA
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#9] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 7:51:00 PM | | |
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Yeah, I actually knew that. The trade and it's practices came from "The Old Country". Sometimes I have a hard time thinking beyond this country.
I believe the little holes are called putlocks aren't they, Bill (or at least that's the way it was always pronounced anyway).
Why aren't they filled in on the building you show? I suppose they've simply fallen out and weren't tended to?
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Staten Island, New York
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#10] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 7:51:10 PM | | |
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I've seen masons using this type of scaffolding. They have a 4x4 with a key attached at one end. It fits in the joint between two bricks, and then poled to the ground. It works great, especially on uneven ground.
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Steven Turetsky, UID#16000002314
Comprehensive Home & Building Inspections
www.homeinspectionsnewyork.com
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Staten Island, Manhattan, Brooklyn, Queens, Bronx, Long Island, Westchester
"The great aim of education is not knowledge, but action".
Herbert Spencer 1830-1903 |
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Ashland, VA
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#11] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 8:01:21 PM | | |
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One of the first masons that I worked for was a pretty good welder. He used small I-Beams with a plate steel tongue welded on them which rested on the brickwork. The tongue was no thicker than a bed joint so you could lay brick right on over them. The I-beam had two steel dowels welded on top perfectly spaced to receive the first set of steel scaffolding legs. Screw jacks were put under the other end of the I-beams. You always had a perfectly level scaffold from one end to the other. It was great.
In fact, he also used to take old pickup trucks with simply a cab and frame and weld a mortar mixer on the back of it! He'd have one mortar man supplying two seperate crews within the development from a single staging area. The guy would simply put all the ingrediants in and drive to the site and dump it in a box.
Before the light aluminum corner poles that masons use today were commercially available, this guy was making them out of square tubular steel for his crews.
He was brilliant.
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#12] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 8:17:15 PM | | |
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In the UK, I've never heard of them referred to as putlock holes. At Wmsburg, (the Palmer House) we called them putlog holes.
They might be left open on some buildings to accommodate future repairs or re-pointing. This barn may be for pigeon roosts. Dovecotes were common then.
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| Bill Kibbel, Historic & Commercial Building Inspections - Old House Resources |
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Ashland, VA
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#13] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 8:27:35 PM | | |
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Dovecotes? INPUT, Bill... 
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Ashland, VA
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#14] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 8:30:37 PM | | |
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Oh, BTW, guys... I use a plumb bob today to site chimneys when I think they're leaning. It's in my bag at all times. All you have to do is stand away from the chimney about a good 50 feet or so and hold out the plumb bob at arms length, close one eye and line it up. Works like a charm.
(It's the only way to keep rough stone straight. You can't use a level.)
With a little practice you can become a master with a plumb bob and it doesn't take up much space in your bag.
I use a vintage heavy solid brass one. She's a beauty.
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Staten Island, New York
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#15] Posted: 05/10/2006 - 9:06:33 PM | | |
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Plumb bob... great tool! More carpenters should carry them. I like your technique, quick and easy. It could also let you know if a building is leaning too.
The only problem I find with a bob is that on long drops, even with a heavy bob, it tends to sway from the wind (when outdoors). I guess when hanging it inside a chimney/stack, wind isn't a problem.
Another tool I use often and is great for plumb, level and straight is a transit. I prefer it over a laser. Besides being difficult to see a laser in daylight, the further away from the source, the larger the dot/line. If you compound that with the fact that not consistantly marking the top, middle or bottom of the dot/line changes the measurment, a transit is the way to go if accuracy counts.
I recently built a very long dock, besides the pilings being set plumb. They lined up as straight as an arrow all the way out.
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Steven Turetsky, UID#16000002314
Comprehensive Home & Building Inspections
www.homeinspectionsnewyork.com
www.eifsinspectionsnewyork.com
Staten Island, Manhattan, Brooklyn, Queens, Bronx, Long Island, Westchester
"The great aim of education is not knowledge, but action".
Herbert Spencer 1830-1903 |
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Gaston, Oregon
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Staten Island, New York
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#17] Posted: 05/11/2006 - 02:25:58 AM | | |
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Jim,
The only thing that I believe mercury would do is add weight. I have an assortment of bobs, and even the heaviest are effected by the wind. It's the string that catches the wind, and it doesn't take much to move it.. The transit solves that problem.
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Steven Turetsky, UID#16000002314
Comprehensive Home & Building Inspections
www.homeinspectionsnewyork.com
www.eifsinspectionsnewyork.com
Staten Island, Manhattan, Brooklyn, Queens, Bronx, Long Island, Westchester
"The great aim of education is not knowledge, but action".
Herbert Spencer 1830-1903 |
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Chicago, IL
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#18] Posted: 05/11/2006 - 05:21:17 AM | | |
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I've just got a cheapie that I picked up @ the local lumberyard; I've always had a hankering for a nice brass bob.
Even though it's a cheapie, I always get this reverential "connected to the ages" feeling when I use it. I find myself thinking about pyramids & aquaducts and all sorts of ancient building wonders. Funny how using a simple tool makes one feel.
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Kurt in Chicago
"If I smell it, it goes in the report".............Phillip Smith...2012
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Comer, GA
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#19] Posted: 05/11/2006 - 05:45:43 AM | | |
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"...Long ago, I met an old mason who told me that he used to drill out his plumb bobs and fill them with mercury to stop them from swaying in the wind..."
I don't know about the sway factor. I try to keep away from handling mercury anyway. What I learned from a mason about the string was to be sure and use braided twine instead of the more common twisted to keep it from spinning.
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Columbus, Mississippi
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#20] Posted: 05/11/2006 - 2:27:46 PM | | |
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[quote]Originally posted by Jim Katen
Long ago, I met an old mason who told me that he used to drill out his plumb bobs and fill them with mercury to stop them from swaying in the wind. Has anyone else ever heard that? Seems to me that it wouldn't work.
There is logical reason to believe that might make it more stable in certain ways. Some modern skyscrapers use giant tanks of liquid at the top of the building to dampen sway from wind or earthquakes. I'm sure you could find articles about the basic principles on the net.
Brian G.
Sloshing Can Be Useful 
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Staten Island, New York
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#21] Posted: 05/11/2006 - 3:16:09 PM | | |
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"Pendulam" effect. Maybe? I still don't think I would trust it for accuracy.
If you look on top of church spires or similar structures such as domes etc., that have large Crosses or other items attached, they sometimes are attached with pendulams to act as a counter balances to compensate for the wind.
I've also heard of computer controlled counter balance weights in sky scrapers to counter act the sway... but there is still sway.
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Steven Turetsky, UID#16000002314
Comprehensive Home & Building Inspections
www.homeinspectionsnewyork.com
www.eifsinspectionsnewyork.com
Staten Island, Manhattan, Brooklyn, Queens, Bronx, Long Island, Westchester
"The great aim of education is not knowledge, but action".
Herbert Spencer 1830-1903 |
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Ashland, VA
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#22] Posted: 05/11/2006 - 4:28:55 PM | | |
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I've seen the large tank of water deal Brian's describing on Modern Marvels on the History Channel. The tank has baffles to soften the slosh and regulate the flow.
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Gaston, Oregon
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Boulder, Colorado
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A Stairway To Heaven?
[#24] Posted: 08/11/2006 - 8:40:36 PM | | |
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plumb bob hangs in a bowl of water and reacts less to wind gusts. Real heavy bob on lightest dacron fishing line you can get away with.
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Kenton Shepard
Peak to Prairie Inspection Service
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Inspection of homes built using alternative building methods
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