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411 locals.com is a huge scam. They profess to keep your info on the first page of the google map. Out of 3 or 4 months I've been front page just a few weeks. I've been sending them e-mails and the only response I get is "we're working aggressively to address your concerns". I've also been leaving phone messages which are not replied too. If you are contacted by these people (Doc Taylor seems to be the ringleader) hang up as fast as you can!

If they have ripped you off as well please join me in giving them bad reviews on sites such as;

http://411locals.pissedconsumer.com/

George Russell

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Gee... I've been really reluctant to respond to this thread, but I guess I've got to be fair to Mainstreet hosts. I've haggled with them a few times and gotten some impressive results for very little money. My site's always done pretty well, mostly because it's been around for sixteen years or so, coming up in maybe the first two or three pages in an internet search. Now, I come up first page and darn near the top on most of the usual search phrases. So, I have to give them a thumbs up until they screw up. [:-wiltel]

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Well Mike, you could just start your own scam to get rich too instead of working hard for it!

Main Street Host's scamming black hat SEO works quickly, for awhile. Eventually it'll catch up to you and you'll drop like a rock in the rankings. There's a right way to do things and a wrong way.

One of my competitors hired them and they put MY vehicle picture on his Google listing, submitted fake reviews, gave him a business address in the middle of the University of Kentucky Campus, etc.

It'll catch up. Karma can be a real bitch!

From wiki

White hat versus black hat

Main article: White or black hat

SEO techniques are classified by some into two broad categories: techniques that search engines recommend as part of good design, and those techniques that search engines do not approve of and attempt to minimize the effect of, referred to as spamdexing. Some industry commentators classify these methods, and the practitioners who employ them, as either white hat SEO, or black hat SEO.[40] White hats tend to produce results that last a long time, whereas black hats anticipate that their sites will eventually be banned once the search engines discover what they are doing.[41]

===============

http://main-street-host.pissedconsumer. ... 60850.html

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Well Mike, you could just rob a bank to get rich too instead of working hard for it!

Main Street Host's scamming black hat SEO works quickly, for awhile. Eventually it'll catch up to you and you'll drop like a rock in the rankings. There's a right way to do things and a wrong way.

One of my competitors hired them and they put MY vehicle picture on his Google listing, submitted fake reviews, gave him a business address in the middle of the University of Kentucky Campus, etc.

It'll catch up.

From wiki

White hat versus black hat

Main article: White or black hat

SEO techniques are classified by some into two broad categories: techniques that search engines recommend as part of good design, and those techniques that search engines do not approve of and attempt to minimize the effect of, referred to as spamdexing. Some industry commentators classify these methods, and the practitioners who employ them, as either white hat SEO, or black hat SEO.[40] White hats tend to produce results that last a long time, whereas black hats anticipate that their sites will eventually be banned once the search engines discover what they are doing.[41]

Thanks for the heads up Erby. While I'm pretty good with PC software and hardware and did build my own web site many MANY years ago, Search Engine Optimization has always been a constantly changing mystery to me. I've recently learned that all our previous attempts to improve our web presence through reciprocal links, is no longer an effective endeavor, because Google wants to make Search Engine Presence a paid for quality of a site.

To this date, I've only agreed to three very small payments, which each did improve a site that was already doing quite well. The site is pretty well entrenched and hasn't been modified very much, which definitely help. But, since this thread, I've been contemplating where to go from here. I may just leave things alone for a while and see what happens.

I certainly had no intention of gaining web presence in an underhanded way - not my nature, that's for sure. I guess I should Google folks more than I do, before I do business? I'm a pretty trusting guy always assuming the best and extending everyone the benefit of the doubt, until they prove that they're not worth of such a courtesy. (PS. They don't host my site - Verio does and has since its inception.)

All that being said, and wishing to do things right, who are some White Had SEO companies?

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SEO is a moving target. What works today will not work in a month. The search engines are always tweaking the rules. When you figure out all the answers, they change the questions.[:-crazy]

If you get a call from someone promising the moon, it's a 99% sure fact that they are a scam. As someone mentioned earlier, their black hat methods will work for a week or two and then you get thrown under the bus.

Google looks at "quality of links" not number of inbound links to avoid the "link farm" game. Age of the site is important, video is important (did you know that YouTube is the SECOND LARGEST search engine behind Google?) frequently changing content is important, testimonials are important, "stickyness" of the site is important - how well do you engage the viewer and how long do they stay on the site. Basics, basics, basics!

There ain't no magic bullets.[:-weepn] Your page titles NEED to have your key words in them. Nobody is searching for "Home". How many of your main site's pages are called "Home" or "contact us" or the always popular "INDEX"? Big FLUNK!

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I suppose, in the real world, to think that one can maintain first page position on an internet search, with millions of folks aggressively jockying for those positions, is just plain unrealistic - pie in the sky. The notion simply defies math and odds, without someone monitoring and tweaking your site by the day (or at least week), which would have to cost dearly.

With that in mind, is it a scam or practically an impossibility?

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I find it comical at the money folks throw at SEO folks to get their site up in the rankings. I have not done anything but to add good content to my site and it remains on the first page and in the top 1-3 under the paid for spots in the areas that I want to work in. I don't have a pretty site but it works....

Keep good content, have good links, good meta tags, good page titles and a domain name that has a little age to it and your site will do just fine.

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I find it comical at the money folks throw at SEO folks to get their site up in the rankings. I have not done anything but to add good content to my site and it remains on the first page and in the top 1-3 under the paid for spots in the areas that I want to work in. I don't have a pretty site but it works....

Keep good content, have good links, good meta tags, good page titles and a domain name that has a little age to it and your site will do just fine.

Exactly. Mine is fourteen years old, and while I've added content at times, I really haven't changed pages much, and it's right up there. Has been for a long time - maybe not on the the first page, but easy enough to find.

I do hook up with anything that google, yahoo, msn, etc allow me to for free, along with local stuff like Merchantcircle, but that's about it.

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When those guys call me I ask, "how did you get my number?"

They usually respond with, "found you on the internet"

"oh yeah?" I say. "then my seo must be working good so thanks and goodbye"

I have used your reponse three times since I read this last week.

Thanks!

Kinda reminds me of the old Seinfeld bit for telephone solicitors.

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When those guys call me I ask, "how did you get my number?"

They usually respond with, "found you on the internet"

"oh yeah?" I say. "then my seo must be working good so thanks and goodbye"

I have used your response three times since I read this last week.

Thanks!

Kinda reminds me of the old Seinfeld bit for telephone solicitors.

I do similar, but try and force the caller (usually the SEO hype-sters) to provide me with a property they must be buying and want an inspection for.

Why else would they be calling my number?

I reply then along the lines noted above and again ask for the address of the property they want inspected.

They pretty much very quickly hang up on me.

Love it.

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My calls are usually from an overseas call center. There is a long delay between when I answer and when they respond. It is also obvious that English is not the first language of the caller and that they are reading from a script.

When you ask questions they keep trying to get back into their script.

Hello this is Bob. May I speak to the person who handles your company website?

Seems like Bob or his brother Thomas call from a dozen or so different numbers that are bogus numbers.

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