NJinspector Posted February 2, 2011 Report Share Posted February 2, 2011 I'll be calling for a Stucco inspection to see what the conditon of the sheating is behind this, but what should they have done at the soffit? Backer rod and flexible seal there as well?? BTW, the owner is a "certified" stucco guy Click to Enlarge 42.86 KB Click to Enlarge 37 KB Click to Enlarge 39.19 KB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibsonguy Posted February 8, 2011 Report Share Posted February 8, 2011 That looks like EIFS, not stucco... and the open cell styrofoam is just stuck to whatever siding was underneath it. I bet there still is an air gap hidden deep under there somewhere. When was the house built? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Kibbel Posted February 8, 2011 Report Share Posted February 8, 2011 I'll be calling for a Stucco inspection to see what the conditon of the sheating is behind this, but what should they have done at the soffit? Backer rod and flexible seal there as well?? For traditional stucco, I don't have any installation detail diagrams that show any sealant or other accessory used where it terminates at protected soffits. That looks like EIFS, not stucco... and the open cell styrofoam is just stuck to whatever siding was underneath it. I bet there still is an air gap hidden deep under there somewhere. When was the house built? Where do you see any indication it's EIFS? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted February 8, 2011 Report Share Posted February 8, 2011 For traditional stucco, I don't have any installation detail diagrams that show any sealant or other accessory used where it terminates at protected soffits. Yeah. My AWCI Plaster/Stucco Manual doesn't have it either and that's troubling. I recall Mike O saying something to the effect that cementitious stucco against wood window/door trim was a disaster in the making. I can see how it wouldn't be a big deal on structural masonry, ICF walls or some other type of 'mass wall' construction that breathes moisture but for wood framing, I have to agree with Mike despite a lack of supporting documentation. Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJinspector Posted February 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2011 No, wasnt EIFS. That finish is thin, either rolled on or sprayed on but its a hard coat base underneath. You can see the metal lath where the electrical service comes through. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted February 8, 2011 Report Share Posted February 8, 2011 No, wasnt EIFS. That finish is thin, either rolled on or sprayed on but its a hard coat base underneath. You can see the metal lath where the electrical service comes through. EIFS is thinner than traditional stucco, but the metal lathe is confusing. EIFS used to be defined as 'polymer based' but these days you can find polymer reinforced traditional stucco. The lines between traditional stucco and EIFS is becoming so diffused that even AWCI doesn't know how to classify some of the variations coming out these days. Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejager Posted February 8, 2011 Report Share Posted February 8, 2011 We are seeing a lot more of the acrylic over a cementitous base, rather than over insulation. This two coat system is quicker than the "pure stucco's" three coat. This document (from the EIFS Council of Canada) could be useful for a EIFS situation, if this were that, but it isn't. It suggests that: "Include [13] mm minimum expansion joint between EIFS and adjacent materials." http://www.eifscouncil.org/images/07240 ... cation.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Raymond Posted February 8, 2011 Report Share Posted February 8, 2011 For starters, he should have applied his stucco before the aluminum soffit, I doubt tradition intended it to terminate against aluminum panels. Then he should have hired a 'certified' tin knocker because that metal work is lousy. Gibsonguy might be right about this being a retrofit installation, it looks like they peeled off the siding and plastered right up to the old trim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibsonguy Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 I can see the metal lath in the 3rd pic now. It's just a bad retrofit that made me think of the EIFS. It appears as if there could be a base under the acrylic finish be it insulation or cementitious, which makes the wall stick out further that the original, or it is simply just installed directly over the existing wall. As I wasn't there, I couldn't feel it myself to know if there is any give in the finish or not. I would never mention EIFS in the report unless I was sure. It is obvious though that the trim and soffits were not removed when the exterior finish was redone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottpat Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 To be considered EIFS you need to have the insulation board. You can also have the insulation board with DEFS (Direct applied Exterior Finish System). You also have PB(polymer based) and PM(polymer modified).PB is more flexible and PM is hard almost like cementitious stucco. The lamina(finish coat) on EIFS and DEFS is acrylic and can also be found on cementitious stucco. In the picture I see what really looks like the stucco is a retrofit onto who knows what. For starters the windows are wrong, they have no header flashing and I see no sealants around the windows. The stucco should never touch the soffits, or other dissimilar materials. I also do not see any control joints, but then I also do not find them all that often on stucco homes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Kibbel Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 The stucco should never touch the soffits, or other dissimilar materials. Can you show us a reference for never touching a soffit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patt Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 See 7.1.4 IBC 2510.3 Installation. Installation of these materials shall be in compliance with ASTM C 926 and ASTM C 1063. IRC R703.6 Exterior plaster. Installation of these materials shall be in compliance with ASTM C 926 and ASTM C 1063 and the provisions of this code. ASTM C 926 7. Application 7.1 General: 7.1.1 Portland cement plaster shall be applied by hand or machine to the nominal thickness specified in Table 1. 7.1.2 Plaster nominal thickness shall be measured from the back plane of the metal plaster base, exclusive of ribs or dimples, or from the face of the solid backing with or without metal plaster base, to the outer surface exclusive of texture variations. 7.1.3 Portland cement-based plaster shall be applied on furred metal plaster base when the surface of solid backing consists of gypsum board, gypsum plaster, wood, or rigid foam board-type products. NOTE 5ââ¬âOn horizontal ceiling supports or roof soffits protected by a drip edge, gypsum board products shall be permitted to be used as backing for metal base to receive portland cement plaster. 7.1.4 Separation shall be provided where plaster abuts dissimilar construction materials or openings. (See A2.1.4.) (A2.1.4 is for interior plaster.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 Finally! ASTM C 926 likely addresses other issues that I can't resolve elsewhere. Looks like I need a copy of it. Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottpat Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 The stucco should never touch the soffits, or other dissimilar materials. Can you show us a reference for never touching a soffit? patt, beat me to it. Beside being an ASTM guideline it is also found with most of the manufacturers guidelines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patt Posted February 11, 2011 Report Share Posted February 11, 2011 Finally! ASTM C 926 likely addresses other issues that I can't resolve elsewhere. Looks like I need a copy of it. Marc Mark if you look at any amount of stucco, you really should have a copy of both C1063 and C926. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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