Loose breakers

[Tom Raymond]

Is anyone aware of issues with loose breakers in Square D Homeline panels?

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Every breaker in this panel was loose and had to be pushed back onto the bus to get the dead-front to go back on. Not falling out of the panel loose, but not tight enough on the bus or where it clips to the enclosure to stay where you put it. It took several tries to keep them all lined up and back all the way. They wouldn't stay seated and most of them would actually slowly move back off the bus when I let go of them.

The GFCI with the white handle tie doesn't fit because it's a CH breaker. I have no idea why the rest of them would be loose.

[Jim Katen]

Square D had two recalls recently, and then there was the counterfeit breaker fiasco. Perhaps it's related to those?

[Tom Raymond]

I read the counterfeit recalls. While the timing is right those were all QO series breakers.

I didn't see anything about recent recalls. I'll have to go look again.

I emailed Support at Schneider to get their take on it. I'll post their position, if they respond.

[Tom Raymond]

I'll wait for Schneider.

Enter "Square D HOM" in the search window at CPSC and I get everything from "support sacks" to "electric mailboxes". That's broken.

[Tom Raymond]

The response from Schneider:

Hi Thomas,

If the QO or HOM breakers were purchased through an anthorized Square D distributor then they are not counterfeit. If not then they could be counterfeit. This is the best way to make that determination.

They can wriggle back and forth, but where it plugs on to the load center, it should be very tight. Once the cover is put on, they don't wiggle much. Sounds like they may not have been installed correctly.

Do the breakers get hot or see burning at the plug on connection? If so the connection is too loose and replace the breakers.

___________________________________________________________________________

Marshall Barker | Schneider Electric | North America USA Inc. |

Senior Product Support Engineer - Circuit Protection

So there are counterfeit HOM series breakers out there. Funny they're not part of the recalls.

One more thing to look for.

[kurt]

I rarely see Square D, so haven't had to think much about recalls. The counterfeits are out of China...surprise surprise.

Chinese electrical equipment is so crappy it would be comical if it wasn't so dangerous. Enclosures are plastic, bus is aluminum, and it's fairly common to find bare wires cast into concrete wall assemblies.

They "build" giant apartment towers with no pre planning on anything. When you buy, you buy an empty concrete box. All wiring and fixture placement is decided upon after purchase, and is described under the general heading of "the decoration".

Guys with Hilti knock off's come in and channel all the conduit pathways out of solid concrete. One thing Chinese do know how to do is mix concrete....they got the concrete part down. Fine grade Portland, pozolli ash, decent sand grade, and a decent aggregate ratio The stuff would spec out around 5000 psi in the States; it's some hard ass shit. Channeling out 5000 psi concrete with a Hilti gun for your career......Think about that.

Oftentimes, conduit runs out and they just lay the wire in the rough concrete trench and mud it in.

So, making crappy breakers probably seemed not so bad.

[gtblum]

According to the Golf Channel, they also seem to be costing equipment manufactures billions. Some are so good at it, They have to cut the clubs open to prove they're fakes.

[kurt]

Europeans were livid at the Americans that were knocking off all the good Euro brands back in early American history.

The up and comers always knock off the good stuff. We did it. We were really good at it. The Chinese are pretty good at it too with some stuff, not so good with other stuff.