Jump to content

Water Tank Valve, Ignorance on Display


Brian G
 Share

Recommended Posts

Thank you Herr Mitenbueler! The only reason I doubted myself was because if you lean down and look under there you see a bunch of little openings that just might be designed for this.

So let me go a step farther down "DUH!" lane. Why does it matter whether the water goes down the tube or just out into the tank? The ones I've seen like this appear to function normally.

Brian G.

A Plumber I Ain't [:-dunce]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There should still be water going down the tube, some going out the normal exit, & a lot is going out the head gasket. The bowl is probably not getting it's "fill", but is getting enough to make it work. While I could get specific, they work this way, although it isn't "right". I'd tell them to repair/replace the tank hardware.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Go figure. Last week I did a house with 3 toilets, all had problems with the supply line for the tube. One missing entirely, one cut very short discharging in the tank, and one very long so badly crimped that no water was passing through it. All of the toilets worked as if nothing was wrong(?). Naturally I wrote 'em up anyway, and these get it too.

Brian G.

If'n It Taint' Right, Taint Right! [^]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is one of the qualities I like about Mr. G, always bringing up stuff I forget about. Now that he's cleared up the leaking head gasket problem I've wondered about, I'll ask another one.

Should there be a 1 inch difference between the top of the fill tube and the ball cockvalve? I've heard something about needing an air gap to prevent possible back siphoning...is this it?

C'mon people, let's talk commodes!

Donald

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Donald Lawson

This is one of the qualities I like about Mr. G, always bringing up stuff I forget about. Now that he's cleared up the leaking head gasket problem I've wondered about, I'll ask another one.

Should there be a 1 inch difference between the top of the fill tube and the ball cockvalve? I've heard something about needing an air gap to prevent possible back siphoning...is this it?

C'mon people, let's talk commodes!

Donald

The fill valve, flush valve, whatever you want to call it should be at least an inch above the top over the overflow tube in the tank to stop back-siphoning and prevent possible cross-connections. Think of it as an air gap.

New guts for most toilet tanks can be had at the big orange box for less then $10. I tell'em they come with directions and if you know a few four letter words, it's a do-it-yourself project.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Great...I've been doing those two things...now on to the third item.

Some ballcocks do not have a fill hose. Should all of them have a fill hose running over to the overflow tube?

I've often thought that those flush assemblies filling from the bottom could be a source of cross contamination. I suppose there is a back flow preventer built in?

Donald

Toilet Mouth For A Day [:-king]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Chad Fabry

we're supposed to look in the tanks? Uh oh.

OK. I'll fess up. I never look in the tank unless it's running when I get there. I check to see it's mounted tight to the flange, flush, & move on. I check back to see if it stops running, but look in the tank? Never.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Donald Lawson

Great...I've been doing those two things...now on to the third item.

Some ballcocks do not have a fill hose. Should all of them have a fill hose running over to the overflow tube?

I've often thought that those flush assemblies filling from the bottom could be a source of cross contamination. I suppose there is a back flow preventer built in?

Donald

Toilet Mouth For A Day [:-king]

I don't worry about those little fill hoses unless they're not tied down and squirt water everywhere. Some run into the overflow tube and some directly into the tank.

Another note: Using toilets to date houses doesn't work here. The City of Austin has been promoting the 1.6 gallon commodes (even giving them away) to cut down on water usage. As a result old toilets hardly exist anymore.

Several years ago I saw a demonstration by the Texas Board of Plumbing Examiners on possible cross-connections. One example was an improper flush valve in a toilet tank. With a loss of water pressure, you could turn on a sink faucet and fill your glass with toilet water.[:-sick]

Texas SOP says look in toilet tanks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Several years ago I saw a demonstration by the Texas Board of Plumbing Examiners on possible cross-connections. One example was an improper flush valve in a toilet tank. With a loss of water pressure, you could turn on a sink faucet and fill your glass with toilet water.[:-sick]

Texas SOP says look in toilet tanks.

Now I'm in the DUH category. I know about this concern, but isn't that "fill your glass w/ toilet TANK water, which is potable water?"

This wouldn't backsiphon toiler BOWL water, would it? How could it?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I live in a rural area with a well and all the pumps and stuff that go with it. We suffer from frequent power outages and before I installed large capcity water storage and a generator, I dipped the tank to make coffee during a no power period. My wife was aghast which was OK because I got all the coffee. The problem was she literally wouldn't kiss me for a week.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by kurt

Several years ago I saw a demonstration by the Texas Board of Plumbing Examiners on possible cross-connections. One example was an improper flush valve in a toilet tank. With a loss of water pressure, you could turn on a sink faucet and fill your glass with toilet water.[:-sick]

Texas SOP says look in toilet tanks.

Now I'm in the DUH category. I know about this concern, but isn't that "fill your glass w/ toilet TANK water, which is potable water?"

This wouldn't backsiphon toiler BOWL water, would it? How could it?

Kurt,

Now that you're gonna start looking in the tanks, you'll be amazed at what is growing in some of them...mold, scum like you wouldn't believe. THAT is what you'd be drinking with a cross-connection. And, you'll be amazed at how many "short" fill valves are installed by homeowners when the original valve fails, creating a cross-connection.

Also, anyone with thoughts on those tanks where the low-profile white fill valve is mounted to the bottom of the tank? If that ain't a cross-connection, what is?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Jerry Simon

Originally posted by kurt

Several years ago I saw a demonstration by the Texas Board of Plumbing Examiners on possible cross-connections. One example was an improper flush valve in a toilet tank. With a loss of water pressure, you could turn on a sink faucet and fill your glass with toilet water.[:-sick]

Texas SOP says look in toilet tanks.

Now I'm in the DUH category. I know about this concern, but isn't that "fill your glass w/ toilet TANK water, which is potable water?"

This wouldn't backsiphon toiler BOWL water, would it? How could it?

Kurt,

Now that you're gonna start looking in the tanks, you'll be amazed at what is growing in some of them...mold, scum like you wouldn't believe. THAT is what you'd be drinking with a cross-connection. And, you'll be amazed at how many "short" fill valves are installed by homeowners when the original valve fails, creating a cross-connection.

Also, anyone with thoughts on those tanks where the low-profile white fill valve is mounted to the bottom of the tank? If that ain't a cross-connection, what is?

Thanks Jerry! You said it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Alas, I am a cretin. Still yet another safety issue to dwell upon.

"If I could not have been a Prince, I would have been a plumber."

Allegedly, that is the final quote of the Earl of Mountbatten(or some one of those inbred English gentry) as he lay on his deathbed, dying of ecoli ingested due to a careless plumber of the 19th century who hooked things up backwards. Ahhh, the cheek of those Brits......

That said, I've had the opportunity to tour various municipal water reservoirs in my day, & they are all mildly nasty w/ scum & crud. In fact, I'm not sure the interior of my mouth is in as good a bacteriological condition as my toilet tank.

I might grudgingly start looking in tanks, but I'm not telling anyone nuthin'. [:(!]

Kiddin.....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

(voice of Arnold Swar...well you know, the bodybuilder / actor / governor) You peoples hafen't been luoking in da toilet tonks? You're chust a bunch ovf girlie inspector men! Go on now, go and cry inza korna like a little girlie, Ya! [:-dev3]

Okay, actually I haven't been doing it that long either, just a few months. I was doing a bathroom one day and the toilet didn't flush right. I took the lid off and found 2 bricks, lots of rust, and no supply line to the tube. Then I started to wonder if I was missing stuff like this often, so I started looking. So far I'd say about every 4th or 5th house has some of these tank issues, so I'll keep looking I guess. I'm sure it'll help to know what the hell I'm looking at. It's not exactly "invasive", you just lift the stinkin' lid off while its' running.

Brian G.

Titan of the Tank [:-batman]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Originally posted by Brian G.

(voice of Arnold Swar...well you know, the bodybuilder / actor / governor) You peoples hafen't been luoking in da toilet tonks? You're chust a bunch ovf girlie inspector men! Go on now, go and cry inza korna like a little girlie, Ya! [:-dev3]

Okay, actually I haven't been doing it that long either, just a few months. I was doing a bathroom one day and the toilet didn't flush right. I took the lid off and found 2 bricks, lots of rust, and no supply line to the tube. Then I started to wonder if I was missing stuff like this often, so I started looking. So far I'd say about every 4th or 5th house has some of these tank issues, so I'll keep looking I guess. I'm sure it'll help to know what the hell I'm looking at. It's not exactly "invasive", you just lift the stinkin' lid off while its' running.

Brian G.

Titan of the Tank [:-batman]

I'll bet you also pee in the laundry tub when no ones lookin'..... [:-eyebrows]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Old news!

I've looked since day one. When I got certified on backflows lots of case studies showed BLUE ICE exist[:-scared]. How about air gaps on hose bibbs? AVB on bidets? Laundry tub air gap? Shower head wands? Look for any way water supply can come into contact with any gray water.

Charlie

CONQUEROR OF THE CROSS CONNECTION

[:-skull][:-skull][:-skull][:-skull]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...