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Hi, Randy, since about 1992, Trane has put the date of manufacturer in the lower right hand corner of that label. Did you happen to look there. I don't see that portion in the photo. OT - OF!!! M.

Hi All, Here's another article about Mr. Morrison. Click the link and scroll all the way down: http://www.banderasnews.com/team/index.htm OT - OF!!! M.

Hi Steve, A word of caution about that. When you use that little compass, you should make sure that you aren't inside a building surrounded by wiring and electronic devices that are producing magnetic fields, and aren't standing under the service drop to the house. Lastly, make sure you are well clear of any automobiles. Using a compass too close to magnetic fields or large chunks of iron or steel, such as an automobile, is a common mistake. You could end up writing a report with the directions skewed. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Hi Randy, A rusted vent can be compared to an oil stain on your garage floor. It's a clue that something else is going on. As I said in that other thread, once you find that, you need to examine that system very thoroughly for other clues and then draw a conclusion as to whether or not there is actually a deficiency that needs to be dealt with, be able to explain why you think it's defective to the client, and why it's not good for the house, and then tell the client what to do about it. I do the exterior and roof first. Some of the things I've found after seeing rusted vents protruding above the roofline are: - Vent terminations that are completely rusted through. - Vents in attics completely rusted through and venting into attics. - Vents in attics with mineral salts completely coating them. - Extremely long horizontal runs of vents in attics with insufficient up-pitch. - Single-walled vents in attics. - Collapsed/restricted vents. - Inoperative inducer fans. - Cracked inducer housings. - Inadequately sized exhaust vents. - Vents with numerous sharp bends exceeding the 60¡Ãƒâ€ maximum that supposed to be allowed for only one bend. - Relatively new furnaces in laundry rooms where the heat exchangers were so rusted that they looked like they were 40 years old. - Furnaces and water heaters installed in rooms or garages without adequate air for combustion. - Cold air returns too close to appliance combustion sources. - Furnaces with damage to components caused by condensate leaking out of inducers because gases were stalling due to these other issues - Many furnaces and water heaters in unheated garages with long runs of single-walled vent material from the collar before it transitions to double-walled material. The rust itself isn't that much of a problem, as long as the vent material is still relatively solid and isn't rusted to the point of collapsing. A wire brush, some rust converter and some high temperature paint is all it takes to clean it up and make it look pretty again. However, making it look pretty won't fix what's causing it. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Hi, Yeah, I would think that the nuisance thing would apply. However, I pulled my regular code check and saw this: - 4ft. below or side and 1ft. above window or door. (IRC 2426.8/UMC 806.6). Not sure why that wasn't included in the HVAC Code Check. Did you call the local code guru to see what's accepted in that muni, or check the installation manual (usually on the side of the unit) to see what's recommended by the manufacturer? OT - OF!!! M.

Hi, Well, my HVAC CodeCheck is a few years old, but I've got: - Vent termination and ir intake min 12in. above grade & any bldg. opening (IRC 2426.8/UMC 806.6) - Vent termination not located where vapors or condensate would be a nuisance (IRC 2426.8/UMC 806.6) - Vent termination min. 3ft. above any forced-air inlet (not furnace intake) (IRC 2426.8/UMC 806.6) ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Yeah, I'd forgotten to address the gutter question. I agree with Kurt on that one. A mechanical device is one thing, but If something is an immovable building component, framing, sheathing, siding, trim, gutters, etc., just examine it and if it's OK move on, or, iIf it's worn out or needs maintenance, tell the client. Aluminum gutters will last a long, long time and I don't even consider any "service life" on those. Steel gutters might last as little as 10 years or as long as 50, if they've been well maintained, sanded and re-primed and re-painted over the years, so you have to judiciously probe them with a finger here and there to see if they're paper thin and ready to give out or simply need to be sanded down, re-primed and repainted. Wood gutters can last up to 75 years, if they've been properly cared for, even though few do because of poor/improper maintenance, and you've got to examine every linear foot of them and make sure that clients understand that they'll need annual scraping and re-oiling and are a lot of work. As far as appliances go, I tell clients that I'm doing a simple on-off check of the appliances. That most seem to last at least 10 years from the date of installation, but some don't, and, since the manufacturers only warrant them for a year, it's anyone's guess as to how long they'll last after the warranty expires. I reinforce this stance by telling them that the only warranty I'll give them on the appliances is: "as long it takes to reach my truck. Once I'm in my truck and backing out of the driveway, if the thing fails, I'll feel sorry for your loss, but that's just the way it is with appliances." They get it. Well, all except for one silly lady, that is, but the remainder have. I've never had one appliance fail in the time it takes me to collect my check, walk to my vehicle, open the door and get in. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Give them the facts as you know them. Take a water heater, for instance. I'll check the serial number to determine its age and then tell the client how old it is. I'll explain that around here water heaters average about 10 to 15 years before they're toast. When a tank is already older than that, I make sure they know that it's beyond the end of its normally expected service life range and that they understand that there's no way to really know when the thing will fail, so the prudent thing to do would be to replace it right away. Then I tell them not to be surprised that, if they should decide to keep the danged thing because it is still serviceable and leak-free, not to be surprised if it fails at any moment and at the most inconvenient time possible. Then I'll recommend that they call around to some dealers to discuss replacement options and cost. Then I make sure I say the same thing in writing in the report. That way, when it does go they will have been forewarned. That's pretty much the way I approach it. Tell 'em where I think whatever it is is in its life cycle. Warn them that once it's at end of normally expected life cycle that there's no way to really know how much longer it will remain serviceable, and, if it's near, at, or beyond that, advise them to repair/replace it right away. At the same time, knowing that there's a strong likelihood that they might cave in and keep the item, rather than lose the house by fighting over it, I make sure they understand that if they don't repair/replace it immediately, not to be surprised if it (whatever it is) fails at any moment and at the most inconvenient time possible. It works for me. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Hi Bill, Back in the 70's, I bought an old Bluebird 54 passenger on a 64 GMC chassis and converted it to a motor home. I had a propane refrigerator, a Caloric range and one of those old Ruud sidearm heaters that I was going to install in it. I think it's a good thing that I didn't, because I heard that they used to be dangerous as hell. OT - OF!!! M.

Man! Wut a payr of poivoits! OT - OF!!! M.

Hi Randy, I'll try and explain what's happening. If I screw it up, Rob will straighten my raggedy-ass explanation out. Just realize that I'm not much of a scientist, so I probably will screw this up. That rusted vent above the roof line is speaking to you. It's saying, "Hey, look at this. The exhaust gases leaving me have cooled so much that they've practically lost all buoyancy by the time they've left me. You need to check this out when you go inside and check out the furnace and water heater, as well as all of the exhaust venting below the roof line that's attached to me. You need to try and figure out why this is happening or refer me to someone who can." The exhaust gases are acidic. If those exhaust gases are hot enough, they'll have plenty of buoyancy when they leave that vent and will rise rapidly away from the roof and the portion of vent exposed above the roof will look great. However, if the exhaust gases in that vent cool too rapidly and lose too much buoyancy - either because the vent is too restricted, has too many bends, is a single-walled vent in an unheated location, There's a bad inducer, or something is causing the furnace to back-draft, etc., by the time they leave the pipe they are being forced out of the vent by gas below and are cooler than the air immediately around the vent. So, instead of rising well clear of the vent they immediately settle around it. That exhaust air, the vapor cloud one often sees hanging lazily around a vent like a halo in cold air, contains acid. That acid reacts to the zinc in the galvanizing on the vent pipe and that reaction causes the vent to corrode on the inside surfaces, producing the white mineral salts that you see filtering down into furnace or water heater from above or leaking out of joints in the vent. That halo cloud hanging around the outside of the vent does the same thing, but the mineral salts are rinsed away leaving the rusted vent pipe. That's why the vent pipe is speaking to you. Hope this makes sense. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Yeah, I think you'd find that a lot of us on this board inspect in much the same way, and that each of us could learn much from each other. I'd love to have the opportunity to be Les', Kurt's or Kim K's shadow for a couple of weeks, and just be able to soak up what I see and hear like a fly on the wall. Learning is fun. However, writing style is something that you must constantly work at and changing one's style isn't easy. If a certain way of writing becomes ingrained, it's difficult to change. I'm a perfect example of someone whose developed a certain way of writing and had difficulty shedding bad/ingrained habits. When you read a post of mine, you have to keep in mind that my writing background is grounded in criminal investigations. Before I became an investigator back in the '70's, I'd hardly written anything except one or two letters since I'd left high school. Then, for the next ten years, in any report I wrote, I had to write laboriously anal descriptive reports to describe crime scenes, explain who, what, where, how, and why (If I knew) crimes had been committed, and then explain every step of my investigation in minute detail, including my own thought processes when reaching certain conclusions about suspects, witnesses or victims. Even after that 10 years as an investigator, a lot of the rest of my Army career was proof-reading police reports and/or instructing soldiers how to properly write those reports. When I retired from the Army and started doing this, I fell immediately into my old custom of observing, analyzing and then reporting what I'd seen in painfully anal and descriptive reports. Learning how to write differently has been a real challenge for me. In the past 10 years, I've found that it wasn't too difficult for me to adjust my writing style from the passive voice used in police writing to an active, present tense voice, but shedding my tendency to over describe and over analyze everything I see has turned out to be impossible. I try though. Those habits are why I can't seem to write a report using boilerplate and I'm never happy with how any boilerplate, even my own, is written. It's gotten so that my 'boilerplate" is now what I've written in the previous home that I had such and such issue with. I'll be writing a report, will get to the point where I need to describe an issue, and then I'll open the file of the last house that had that issue and copy and paste that comment into the current report. It would work fine, except for the fact that I'll then re-write it and tweak it still again and am never completely satisfied with it. Anymore, it takes as long to do that as it would if I'd started from scratch. I think that at some point in life there are some things that one just can't change - that old zebra and stripes thing. Chris, you'll just need to develop a style and methodology that works best for you. You need to be open to ideas from others, experiment with them and change when you think you need to, or are able, but concentrate on being yourself, telling your clients the truth.....always, and documenting everything you see in a way that makes you feel the most comfortable. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Hi, I should have posted these with the last post. I support my comments about the lack of sufficient air for combustion in garages etc. with the following articles that I e-mail to my clients along with the report. JLC Article - Makeup Air For Combustion Equipment JLC Article - Venting Gas Appliances The first is free, but the second will cost you $2.95 unless you are a JLC Online Member (Cost - $59.95 a year without the CD, $99.95 with the CD). When clients are armed with these and hand them off to their builder/contractor, it always seems to work. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Uh, Kurt? You must be deleriously happy 'cuz you forgot the link. Here tis: http://sketchup.google.com/ OT - OF!!! M.

No, it wouldn't. The point I was making there is that if I hadn't written anything about the fact that the home was directly in the path of water coming down off that steep slope behind the home and damaging the retaining wall and flowing directly toward that home, because things were fine, I would have been into it up to my ass. None of the issues with any of those other three clients involved any flash flooding. All of those simply involved common drainage errors that I'd written up and they ranged over a period of nearly 10 years. None of them had a problem...until now. One of them told me straight-out that he'd thought I'd been over-thinking the issue and had over-stated what could happen in my report to him 7 years ago. After every rainy season wherein he continued to ignore those issues, he became more and more convinced.....until now. What if I'd only done his home about 10 months ago and had not written those things up and told them to correct them, simply because there wasn't any evidence of a problem. Where would I be now? Up to my ass in alligators, I suspect. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Hi, But whose to say it's not reasonable when there's no way to really know when it's a 10, 20, 50, 100, 500 or 1000 year cycle? It's like that silly term "100-year flood plain" - what the heck is that supposed to signify? The engineers that built the levees around New Orleans used 200 year old records when deciding how tall and strong to build those things. Surprise! I say just report whatever isn't done correctly. Correct being the best standard of care traditionally used by the construction trade or mandated by codes nationally and then specifically what works best in your region. That's not being knit-picky, it's just telling the truth and that, more than anything else, will keep you out of trouble. The example I cited above is not the only previous client who got slammed with flooding in that storm. I actually had three former clients call me up to tell me that I was right, and to ask for the name of a competent contractor to correct flooding issues for them. All three of them had issues that I'd written up, even though they weren't causing any problems at the time of the inspection, and all of them had ignored those issues for years, because they weren't causing a problem. Then, that storm hit, and those negatively graded areas ended up causing the exact issues that I'd been concerned about. I think if you're recommending what is correct, even in the face of no existing issue, then you're doing what's expected of someone in this profession. It was a little bit stressing to have a three different clients call me up in the space of two days to inform me that they'd experienced flooding issues in a basement, crawlspace or garage, but it sure felt good to learn that I'd documented everything so carefully that they'd called me up to get the name of a contractor and weren't demanding that I shell out to make repairs, because I'd ignored incorrect issues only because everything was copacetic at the time of the inspection. It's not the most popular method to use. I can assure you that I catch a lot of grief from 'zoids, because I insist on writing things up when they're not correct, even when no issues exist because of them, but I believe that it's what's kept me out of trouble and I haven't even had to sit down to an arbitration table for nearly 11 years. I think that is being reasonable. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Hi All, For those of you who've forgotten, and for those new to TIJ, I thought I'd take this opportunity to point out that there's more to TIJ than just the front page and these forums. Don't forget to check out all of the features on TIJ - especially our links and downloads libraries, because these are constantly being added to and, when they are, I don't usually make any announcement on TIJ about it. You'll find the downloads library in the drop-down menu under "Resources" on the menu bar above. These document are there just for you and all of them are free. You've just got to print them out. You can find TIJ's various other features by passing your cursor over the topics on the menu bar above, directly below the TIJ logo. This will produce drop down menus. Just click on a choice and check things out. Come on, live a little and explore this place! ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Ah, so Grasshoppa. I understand now. I would have loved to have been an engineer. I just couldn't get past the math. My brain refuses to comprehend it. Just trying to understand the numbers in the service charges on a bank statement makes my head hurt. When I went through the SF Engineers Q Course, they provided us with a self-study workbook that teaches one mathematics. It is designed to teach you math even if you've never done it in your life. It takes you from 1 + 1 = 2 up through basic calculus and one can work one's way through it in about 2 days. My math comprehension is so bad that I have to break it out every year or so and force myself to work my way through it all over again. Then, for a few months, I'll remain somewhat competent at math until it's lost again, and I repeat the cycle. It's very frustrating. I cudda been a cointenda! OT - OF!!! M.

Hi, Weeps should definitely not be blocked by grading, and the finished floor level shouldn't be below grade, but it's not unheard of for a few bottom courses of brick veneer to extend below grade. Some builders do it that way intentionally, placing the brick shelf below grade, and then they fill the core between bricks and the foundation all the way up to where they install their thru-wall flashings and weeps, several courses above. That provides a nice traditional look without the unsightly concrete band around the base of the structure below the veneer. As long as the grading isn't higher than the sills in this configuration, it's OK, because the thru-wall flashings function as a substitute for a damp course. I almost never see this done here, unless it's on a very high-end home. Around here, it's pretty common not to find thru-wall flashings and weeps. Is the lot truly flat or does it just appear flat? Around here, because we don't have a lot of snow, you can get away with grade that's as little as 1/2" per foot away from the structure and not get flooding in a basement, even though we get a ton or rain from September through April. A lot graded like that appears "flat" too. If it's truly flat, or if you've got negative grading, and you're trying to figure out where to send all of that water, think in terms of creating a shallow swale, with a French drain at it's bottom, around the structure, centering the French drain 6ft from the foundation wall, ensuring that the water near the foundation, as well as that in the yard, drains into the swale. This lets the French drain collect the water and then you'd want the French drain to convey that to drywell somewhere else on the property that's well clear of the foundation. Unless you've got clay or a high water table, this should be able to handle just about anything that nature will throw at it, short of an actual flood. DO NOT place French drains right up against a foundation wall and expect them to prevent infiltration. It doesn't work - they need to be right at the 6ft. mark if they're to work effectively. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Cousin, You're hilarious. I'm reminded of some of the stuff that Walt Jowers says on the ASHI board every once in a while to discourage inspectors from relocating to the Nashville area. Can't remember what it was - only that it was funny as hell. Never fear, Jimmy Boy, there ain't no way I'd be able to get the Korean Konnection to relocate to Meheeko. Maybe back to the land of the morning calm, but that's about it. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Hi, In Washington State, all home inspectors are required to be licensed Structural Pest Inspectors and SPI are required by law to write up any pest conducive conditions, whether they are negatively impacting a home or not. That means that any grading near the home that doesn't slope away from the foundation must be written up; water ponding near a home must be written up; firewood stacked near the home must be written up; improper clearance from grade must be written up; earth-to-wood contact must be written up; gutters pitched a little bit the wrong way that hold any water must be written up; any vegetation touching a structure must be written up; wood stored beneath a deck must be written up, etc., etc.. There isn't a whole lot happening on the exterior of a house that the authors of that law (originally written primarily by pest inspectors) didn't term a "pest conducive" condition. One of those that was in on that process, told me months ago that, when they put together the draft of that law and handed it over to legislators, their intent was to erect obstacles that would discourage home inspectors from getting into the business, because they were fed up with home inspectors making the wrong calls on bugs and rot. It didn't work. Chris, I write narrative reports. I describe grading, as well as any in-ground drainage I can find, patios, flatwork, vegetation near the home, and walks and drives. I also describe how it appears to me drainage is configured, and always write up anything that I'm not happy with, whether it's impacting the home or not. I don't bother to try and explain why something is technically incorrect but isn't negatively impracting the home. Why would I? If it's wrong, it's wrong, and not pointing that out, just because the house is fine and there's no evidence that it's ever been an issue could come back to bite you one day. This year, we here in the Seattle area found out how true that is. There were homes flooded here this year that, despite improper grading at the exterior, have never had an ounce of water in their basements in half a century. Two days before that big storm in Seattle on December 16th, I'd inspected a little upgraded bungalow in the Madison neighborhood of Seattle. The grading around the house was poor but the basement was dry as a bone and didn't show any indication that it's been flooded since the 1980's when the basement was remodeled - largely due to the fact that there was a sump pump working in one end, which the listing agent assured my client could keep up with anything. I wrote up the retaining walls between that property and the neighbor on one side, for lack of dead men and I wrote up the negative grading around the structure, basically telling the client that, lack of flooding or not, it was wrong and the sump pump was clear evidence that the yard doesn't drain correctly. He walked - for that and for many other issues - most of which were not negatively impacting the home, but were just plain wrong and he didn't want to have to deal with fixing them. The next day, during that storm, a 4ft. high wall of water came down the slope behind the house, crossed the service road, knocked down the fence, caved in the neighbor's retaining wall, hit the exterior basement door, taking out the door and door casing, and filled the basement to grade level with nearly 4ft. of water. Three houses down, that wall of water caved in one whole side of a basement and the occupant, a voice-over actress who does voices for animated films and books for the blind, etc., went into the basement and tried to save her studio. She became trapped and drowned. Man, was I thankful that I'd been so anal about writing up all of those issues, even though they'd not negatively impacted that home for decades, and that my client had walked. If he hadn't, I might have had to explain why the 25-year old basement remodel was ruined, there was 4ft. of water in the basement and the fence and retaining wall needed to be rebuilt. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

OK, Thanks Bill, I understand now. Gary, if that that's a tenon (what most non-woodworkers will refer to as a tongue) on the end of that rafter, and it extends up into a square slot (mortise) cut in the end of the beam that houses it on 3 sides, the correct term, and the one most woodworkers will use, is an open-mortise-and-tenon joint, although a tongue-and-fork joint or fork-and-tongue has been used by non-woodworkers to describe these joints as well. I'd have expected to see a mortise-and-tenon joint used in a timber-frame structure. In his book, The Timber-Frame Home, Tedd Benson, desribes their use for rafter joints at the ridge. I've just never seen one used in a house - at least not in a "modern" house. Of course, Bill works with very old buildings, so he probably sees them all the time. I've been in what is believed to be the oldest surviving building in Washington state - a log cabin up on Whidbey Island owned by some friends of mine - but it only dates to 1855. That would be considered a kid compared to some of the buildings Bill looks at. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Oh yeah! Last year, I read an article about how there are some great opportunities opening up in China for construction companies willing to set up operations over there building western-style housing. They have large enclaves set aside over there with high brick walls around them and once you enter it's like walking into an American city. Lots of opportunity for the American contractor with some moxie. The same thing is going on in Korea but those aren't isolated enclaves - they're set up just about anywhere where they can get the land. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Hi, I think it depends both on the type of application and on the manufacturer. The B-vent instructions on the Simpson Dura-Vent site say that it's okay to connect B-vent material directly to an appliance, but when it refers to the flexible B-vent material it says that a draft hood adaptor is required. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike

Hi Bill, See, that's what I mean. I've never been down there, and don't really know anyone that's ever been down and talked about it much, so it's been off my radar. Guess I need to add Meheeko to my list of places to check out on vacation if I ever take one. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike