Norm Posted June 15, 2004 Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 Would you call this a functional defect? Don't be too sure. Download Attachment: Functional Defect.jpg 188.07 KB The swimming pool and sub-panel were installed long after the home was completed. Download Attachment: pool added after construction.jpg 169.35 KB How would you report this? Download Attachment: red flag.jpg 160.33 KB What's wrong here? Download Attachment: service switch.jpg 114.4 KB What conditions must be satisfied in order to use this devise? Download Attachment: split bolt connector.jpg 204.42 KB What's missing? How do you confirm it? Download Attachment: steel column four feet from pool.jpg 182.96 KB Next week extremely costly defects. NORM SAGE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottpat Posted June 15, 2004 Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 Neat stuff, I might need to learn more about pools instead of sending the inspections to a pool company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Pritchard Posted June 15, 2004 Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 1.The pool will still work but I doubt there is still a continuity of the bonding to the screen enclosure. 2.Subpanel needs help by a real electrician 3.Not sure what the problem is here other than a potential cross connection. 4.Switch is not weatherproof. 5.No idea. 6.Bonding wire is not present. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonTx Posted June 15, 2004 Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 1. I'd call it a defect or at least one heck of a leaf catcher! 2. Double tapping of the main breaker. I'm not sure if this is the main panel or a sub. Add a subpanel or breaker? 3. Looks like some previous repairs to the deck and some staining. I think the garden hose is there to throw us off. 4. A weather cover is needed and if that's the pool lights, a GFCI. 5. Looks like the bonding lug broke off of the equipment. 6. Column not bonded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian G Posted June 15, 2004 Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 1. I'd report that as FUBAR. 2. Garden-variety double-lugging, recommend qualified electrician, rewire, etc. 3. Probable leakage. Evaporation doesn't require a garden hose to keep up. Disclaim. 4. Has to be at least 5 feet from the inside wall of the pool, unless seperated by a barrier. I'd tell 'em to replace the cover as well. 5. If that's an equipment ground it has to be connected to a terminal, not spliced 6. No visible grounding lug. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't...assume it's not. You could check continuity to something you know is bonded. Brian G. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian G Posted June 15, 2004 Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 Norm my friend, let me suggest a minor style alteration for the sake of clarity. Originally posted by NormWould you call this a functional defect? Don't be too sure. Download Attachment: Functional Defect.jpg 188.07 KB The swimming pool and sub-panel were installed long after the home was completed. Download Attachment: pool added after construction.jpg 169.35 KB How would you report this? Download Attachment: red flag.jpg 160.33 KB What's wrong here? Download Attachment: service switch.jpg 114.4 KB What conditions must be satisfied in order to use this devise? Download Attachment: split bolt connector.jpg 204.42 KB What's missing? How do you confirm it? Download Attachment: steel column four feet from pool.jpg 182.96 KB Next week extremely costly defects. NORM SAGE The dividing line is right above the "size" box on the menu. Sometimes I'm not sure which photo the question refers to. Brian G. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Fabry Posted June 15, 2004 Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 The hose photo sticks out to me because of the efflorescence on the patio under the hose path and then continuing to the edge. The hose bib connection probably drips a little and follows the hose to the concrete. This indicates the hose is on often and for a long time. I don't get the screen enclosure failure other than the fact it's broken. The electrical double tap is obvious, but for the life of me I can't figure out why they've double tapped unless the spa isn't fused at all. I'm assuming that the sub panel is the feeder for the pool and the spa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted June 15, 2004 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 Thanks Brian, I found it and it does make it clearer. NORM SAGE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul MacLean Posted June 15, 2004 Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 Getting in here late makes it easy. What did the guys miss Norm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted June 16, 2004 Author Report Share Posted June 16, 2004 ANSWERS 1. While this may vary geographically, the standard Florida realestate contract excludes screening and classifies it as cosemetic. Needless to say I report small holes in screens let alone major damage (as in the photo) as functional defects. I am not a party to the contract. 2. The pool contractor's electrician double lugged the main in order to feed a subpanel. This is, however, not your run of the mill double lugging. The service to this house is underground. The service lateral runs to the meter. From the meter the service conductors enter the main disconnect box and are routed up to the main breaker. As you can see the double lugging has been done on the line side of the main breaker rather than the load side. This results in no overcurrent protection for the conductors between the main and the subpanel 3. Brian you are correct. Whenever I see a hose laying on the pool deck I suspect the possibility of a pool shell leak and recommend further investigation by a leak detection firm. 4. Danny and Donald you're correct. This is the pool pump motor service switch. The weatherproof cover is missing. 5. This a split bolt connector being utilized to connect two bond conductors. Split bolt connectors are brass and may be used to attach two bond conductors to each other or one conductor to the pool shell rebar. The head of the bolt portion is embossed with the rating of the device. In the photo below the small one is labeled 16-6, the medium one 18-8, and the large one 4/0. They can be used to connect two conductors whose size range is within the listed rating on the bolt. In no case may the size of the largest conductor exceed the largest number embossed on the bolt. Download Attachment: Split Bold Connector.jpg 32.09 KB 6. Danny, Donald, And Brian you're correct. There is no visable bond wire to the steel column. There may, however, be one below the surface of the deck. The only way to be sure is to run a continuity test between a visably bonded piece of equipment and the column. NORM SAGE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurt Posted June 16, 2004 Report Share Posted June 16, 2004 This has been extremely helpful. I now understand that I don't understand diddly squat about pools & equipment, probably because I hardly ever see them. Thanks Norm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonTx Posted June 16, 2004 Report Share Posted June 16, 2004 This series has been very helpful to me also. I wanna see some of those expensive repairs, shell/deck/coping defects, etc. One thing in specific if you have a pic Norm. I keep hearing about cracks around the skimmer housing. I know they need to be sealed. I'd like to see some pics of exactly where to look for these cracks and where they need to be sealed. Thanks Norm! Donald Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted June 16, 2004 Author Report Share Posted June 16, 2004 Donald, I believe I have the photos you are requesting. If I don't, the condition is so common, I will have them by the end of the week. NORM SAGE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rlskfoster Posted December 21, 2004 Report Share Posted December 21, 2004 I know I'm way late entering this conversation but I only recently found this incredible website. One other thing to add on picture #4 with the weatherproof switch needing a cover is that the top of a weatherproof panel has been penetrated with what looks like an offset nipple. I believe that the top 1/3 or maybe even top 2/3 of an exterior panel is not supposed to be penetrated. I don't have my NEC handy but I think that one of these is correct and definately not the top of the panel with this connection. I just want to throw in that this site has already been so informative I wish I had found it two years ago. Thanks to all you guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Fabry Posted December 21, 2004 Report Share Posted December 21, 2004 welcome to the board, Buster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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