esch Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 Sorry, but no pictures, I just looked at it for a friend and didn't have my camera with me. The house is 5-6 years old and was built by some yahoo who didn't know what he was doing (Words of my friend, but I do agree.). It has vinyl windows and metal siding (I believe its called type M - it's been a while). _ _ _ _ _ / \_______/ \__________/ \____________/ \_____________/ \_ Do you like the "picture"? =) I believe the windows are new construction type with a nailer flange. It appears the windows were attached to the stud wall before installing the siding. Then the metal siding was installed over the stud walls (hopefully with firring strips/purlins). The metal is fairly clean cut within 1/2" or so from the side of the windows. The windows are not trimmed whatsoever and the joint between the metal and the vinyl is not caulked, There is BOUND to be water running down the metal siding on the inside during even light rains. Would the correct thing be to remove the siding sheets, install J-mold and reattach the siding? It's a pain in the butt, but there is supposed to be a J-Mold around the windows correct? (remember this is NE oklahoma.... heh) Thanks, Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hausdok Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 Hi, Yeah, it needs J-channel installed. Here's a link to a pretty decent metal siding installation manual that provides details. There's very little difference between detailing the windows in the horizontal stuff or the vertical stuff. The vertical directions are all the way in the back. Enjoy: http://www.gentekinc.com/images/genteku ... uide_G.pdf ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Katen Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 Hi, Yeah, it needs J-channel installed. Here's a link to a pretty decent metal siding installation manual that provides details. There's very little difference between detailing the windows in the horizontal stuff or the vertical stuff. The vertical directions are all the way in the back. Enjoy: http://www.gentekinc.com/images/genteku ... uide_G.pdf ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike I think he's talking about ribbed metal agricultural panels, or what we call Ag Metal. It's the stuff they put on pole barns. - Jim Katen, Oregon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hausdok Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 Hi Jim, Yeah, I thought that's what he meant too. With those, they just basically cut a hole or slot out of the panel and fit it over the door or around the window. However, the window details are the same, no? OT - OF!!! M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Katen Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 Hi Jim, Yeah, I thought that's what he meant too. With those, they just basically cut a hole or slot out of the panel and fit it over the door or around the window. However, the window details are the same, no? Sort of. Except it seems that the edge of a window always falls on one of the ribs. I can't recall having ever seen a building with ribbed metal siding and windows where the siding didn't leak around the windows. You can never get a nice tight joint and, if you use caulk, it always fails because the large panels expand and contract so much with changes in temperature. I'm pretty much convinced that Ag metal belongs on Ag buildings, not on houses. - Jim Katen, Oregon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esch Posted October 15, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 I think he's talking about ribbed metal agricultural panels, or what we call Ag Metal. It's the stuff they put on pole barns. - Jim Katen, Oregon Yeah Ag Metal is practically the same thing sometimes different Gauge. Its one of the cheaper/est metal roofs that still looks good. The town I'm in is a high welfare, high poverty, high rental unit town so the cheapest way out is commonly the way it is done. The sheets are 3' on center (rib to rib not edge to edge) with 5 1-1/2 wide by 3/4 tall ribs and 2 flat raised strips between each rib for added strength. The sheets are whateve rlength you need, say you have a wall 35' to ridge, you order a sheet long enough to go from top to bottom in one run, no joints, same as on the roof. (Wonder how this affects expansion/contraction or if it is enough to worry about) It is VERY common to be on a roof here, and sometimes on the side of a house. Althouh If I was doing roof and siding metal I would just have a metal building built, and build a house inside and detail it nicely, hard to tell the difference if your not looking for it (but you would because the metal outside....) So on a house does there need to be j-mold around the windows? Or are you a beleiver of, "pole barn, not pole house" =) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Raymond Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 Here is the short answer, proper detailing is required no matter what the siding is. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hausdok Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 Hi, Well, the term is "post-frame building" or "frame building" for short - not pole-barn, and it's a perfectly legitimate construction technique; just not one that's been used a whole lot for residential construction over the last hundred years or so or that a whole lot of home inspectors are familiar with. The technique is coming back though because it's a cheaper way to build a pretty solid home. If you have a lot of post-frame houses in your area you should get subscriptions to Rural Builder and Frame Building News. I usually learn one or two things every issue. Yeah, you need a J-channel around the windows. Some of the new artsy-fartsy condos here in Seattle are wood framed with metal skin applied in rain screen fashion. Those have deep ribs and deep J-channels around the windows and doors. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Katen Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 Hi, Well, the term is "post-frame building" or "frame building" for short - not pole-barn, and it's a perfectly legitimate construction technique; Sure, but if I say "post-frame building" people stare. Then I say "pole barn" and they all relax and say, "Oh, why didn't you just say so?" Even the people who build them seem to have never heard the term post-frame construction. just not one that's been used a whole lot for residential construction over the last hundred years or so or that a whole lot of home inspectors are familiar with. The technique is coming back though because it's a cheaper way to build a pretty solid home. The problem is that the people who build these things are accustomed to building agricultural buildings, not homes. Homes require a degree of finesse that seems to escape most barn builders. If you have a lot of post-frame houses in your area you should get subscriptions to Rural Builder and Frame Building News. I usually learn one or two things every issue. Yeah, you need a J-channel around the windows. Yes, but there's a difference between building a post frame home and building a stud-frame home and putting Ag metal on it. The bottom line is that the installation requires forethought and attention to detail. Some of the new artsy-fartsy condos here in Seattle are wood framed with metal skin applied in rain screen fashion. Those have deep ribs and deep J-channels around the windows and doors. That's probably the best way to do it. But it's expensive, time consuming, and requires adherance to a strict set of installation standards. Given Esch's description of his town, that's not likely to happen. - Jim in Oregon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esch Posted October 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 Thanks for all the feedback, Youre right about the description of the town, sheese.... every since I moved here I find something new... Funny to look at, not so funny to repair/replace. Thanks, Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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