rbaake Posted April 23, 2011 Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 Anyone have a way to positively identify a split-bus panel? I found this GE panel in a condo today and could not determine for sure it it's a split-bus. Condo built in 1980, which leads me to believe it probably is seeing they were not used in residential construction after 1984. Also, if it's a split-bus panel, why the punch-out for a main? Thanks for your help! Download Attachment: Box2.jpg 61.24 KB Download Attachment: Box1.jpg 63.08 KB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hausdok Posted April 23, 2011 Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 Anyone have a way to positively identify a split-bus panel? I found this GE panel in a condo today and could not determine for sure it it's a split-bus. Condo built in 1980, which leads me to believe it probably is seeing they were not used in residential construction after 1984. Also, if it's a split-bus panel, why the punch-out for a main? Thanks for your help! Download Attachment: Box2.jpg 61.24 KB Download Attachment: Box1.jpg 63.08 KB Did you look at the schematic on the door to the left? Click to Enlarge 16.15 KB ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbaake Posted April 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 Mike, I did, but to be totally honest I'm not sure what to look for on the schematic. For some reason, I tend to think double poled breakers on split-bus panels would be installed at the top of the bus bars. Is that bad information on my part? I have not seen many of these panels. Any information you have is appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Moore Posted April 23, 2011 Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 I'm not sure what the schematic is showing. Any photos of the whole label? Anyway...I blew up the first photo. I can't see any larger wires coming from a breaker and returning to the panel. The large 30-amp breaker, bottom left appears to be abandoned. The other two sets of breakers with handle ties (30 & 50 amps) looks like they are in use but those wires appear to exit the panel. Based solely on what I can see, I would say that this is not a split-bus panel. And, if so, something wrong here (aside from the doorbell transformer and the access). The panel either breaks the 6-throw rule if it's service equipment, or it's an improperly wired sub-panel. Roy...were there remote service disconnects for the condo? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbaake Posted April 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 Thanks Richard, No, all off of one service drop (photo included) supplying seven one bedroom condos. The breaker you mentioned is not abandoned. It supplies one of two GE Zonelite through-the-wall heat pumps. I mentioned the six throws, but also said the panel may be a split-bus-verify. I told her to verify because several other electrical issues were noted. All the pictures are below. Again, thanks for the information. Download Attachment: Photo 3.jpg 49.92 KB Download Attachment: Photo 4.jpg 83.35 KB Download Attachment: Service_Drop.jpg 61.87 KB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Kibbel Posted April 23, 2011 Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 ...or it's an improperly wired sub-panel. Roy...were there remote service disconnects for the condo? That is my guess as well. I think it's pretty easy to spot a split bus: Click to Enlarge 48.58 KB (ItI stole the pic from a post from Chad over a year ago). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbaake Posted April 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 Bill, I know Pete Wilden would call your split-bus out as a Safety Issue! Door bell transformers in electrical panels, I'm starting to think they're built in as I see them almost everyday...welcome to the New Jersey shore. Wildwood NJ, only place I know where the plumbing inspector signs off on electrical inspections. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Katen Posted April 23, 2011 Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 Roy, dude, you've got to learn to take better pictures. I really can't tell much from the photos, but it really doesn't look like a split bus design. - Jim Katen, Oregon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neal Lewis Posted April 23, 2011 Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 Roy, that unit is known as a PTAC Package Terminal Air Conditioner/Heater. Many times they're A/C but straight electric heating rather than a heat pump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neal Lewis Posted April 23, 2011 Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 Roy, one of the gents here posted pics of several split bus designs awhile back. Here's the GE model. Richard mentioned the lack of the sub-feed cable in your example. Click to Enlarge 70.72 KB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kogel Posted April 23, 2011 Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 Somewhere there is a room or cabinet with meters in it. That is where there should be 7 main breakers for the 7 units. That makes your panel a sub panel. In my area at least, the 6 breaker rule does not apply, because there is one main breaker, (which firemen can access to turn off power). Double taps and missing cable clamps you probably saw. I have found I get blurry shots from holding the camera too close. Better to increase the resolution, then to get a closeup, crop the pic on the PC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgbinspect Posted April 23, 2011 Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 Somewhere there is a room or cabinet with meters in it. That is where there should be 7 main breakers for the 7 units. That makes your panel a sub panel. In my area at least, the 6 breaker rule does not apply, because there is one main breaker, (which firemen can access to turn off power). Double taps and missing cable clamps you probably saw. I have found I get blurry shots from holding the camera too close. Better to increase the resolution, then to get a closeup, crop the pic on the PC. With my field camera - a 14 megapixel Nikon CoolPix, I find that to photograph in tight, for labels, etc. I have to toggle to "close up" mode - usually the symbol will be tulips or something similar. That, maked it possible to photograph a gnat. [:-thumbu] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparky_1 Posted July 1, 2011 Report Share Posted July 1, 2011 this is a sub panel not a a split bus the reason for a knock out for a main is with a main breaker kit you can make is a main panel. if you have a split bus you would see normally a 60A breaker below 6 spaces the wires that come from the 60A breaker would go down and be welded to the lower bus. I'm a Oregon Journeyman and have been for 20 year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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