Carson2006 Posted October 8, 2013 Report Share Posted October 8, 2013 Per request of Mr. Jim Katen, I?ve hastily developed this talking paper regarding electrical worker safety in regards to the tasks that I believe most home inspectors accomplish. It is not intended to persuade use of these practices nor condemn those who don?t. It is simply a glimpse into these practices and is for informational purposes only. Cheers! Mr. Carson Download Attachment: TALKING PAPER Electrical Safety.pdf 162.55 KB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted October 9, 2013 Report Share Posted October 9, 2013 It's an excellent intro to current available information on electrical safety. I had never known that the field was developed that far. I'm not sure how much of this is practical in HI work. At least some parts of it can be implemented without too much trouble and it's a sound idea. One more thing - how do I get the paper to...uhmm...talk? Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Katen Posted October 9, 2013 Report Share Posted October 9, 2013 That's great, Larry. Thanks. If you'd like, I can provide some editing to polish it up and we could run it as a feature article on this site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carson2006 Posted October 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2013 For the record, unlike the cassette recorders of our day which talked to us the "talking paper" is a format typically used in the U.S. Air Force to present key points in a simple manner. However, off the record, I could never get the dang paper to talk to me either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carson2006 Posted October 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2013 That's great, Larry. Thanks. If you'd like, I can provide some editing to polish it up and we could run it as a feature article on this site. That would work for me Mr. Katen. It was hastily done but informative to a degree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lamb Posted October 9, 2013 Report Share Posted October 9, 2013 I found the info long winded and boiler platey. "Hasty," as Mr. Carson admits. What are the bones that an HI realistically faces, "in the tasks that most HI's accomplish." inspecting electric? When, for instance, will an HI see an Arc Blast? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted October 9, 2013 Report Share Posted October 9, 2013 There was someone here who posted a while back, said he had removed the cover from a panel and lo and behold, some cylindrical metal object dang near rolled off the top of the surface-mounted panel and fell into it. That mighta qualified for an arc blast had it happened. Who was it that posted that? Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kogel Posted October 9, 2013 Report Share Posted October 9, 2013 There was someone here who posted a while back, said he had removed the cover from a panel and lo and behold, some cylindrical metal object dang near rolled off the top of the surface-mounted panel and fell into it. That mighta qualified for an arc blast had it happened. Who was it that posted that? Marc It was John Dirks, the TV repairman. [] Re: Electrical safety, HI's in my province of BC have been told that we should be turning power off to the panel before removing the cover. We are told we should seek the HO's permission before cutting the power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkenney Posted October 9, 2013 Report Share Posted October 9, 2013 If i'm not mistaken, Mr. Carson is suggesting that the HIs level of activity never exceeds a category 0. The NFPA table relevant here is NFPA 70E Table 130.7© (15) (a) Hazard/Risk Category Classifications included here. Download Attachment: Table 130.7.pdf 33.69 KB Note that activity that includes measurement in say a live panelboard is a category 1 hazard. That page is from the 2009 edition. The 2012 edition clarifies some of the clothing and glove requirements (the PPE clothing chart is Table 130.7©(16). You can find the 2012 NFPA 70 E complete here: http://www.mcieast.marines.mil/Portals/ ... dition.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carson2006 Posted October 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2013 Good feedback, I like it. First I?d like to mention that it is not my intent to impress anyone. I simply assisted as asked. Hey I enjoy this site and couldn?t imagine doing what you guys/gals do! It?s a lot of work to be knowledgeable in all the required facets of your job. As far as my advice that I provide on occasion, that?s pretty much it, its advice. One can take it or leave it; doesn?t matter to me. I?m simply on here to help when I can. If I may respond. Agreed Mr. Lamb, the document does seem boring if you will. I suppose I could have written it as a suspense novel, but the topic is technical and it would have taken more time to write as a novel. (Jesting of course). But you do bring up a good point about tasks that HI?s perform. As I mentioned, I have limited knowledge about the home inspection process and frankly am not sure exactly of all electrical tasks performed by the typical HI. However it seems some HI?s do perform electrical tasks that do apply to NFPA 70E, as mentioned in the document. Anytime one removes a cover from a loadcenter, open the door of a disconnect switch they are performing electrical tasks regardless of the persons intent, whether it be visual inspection or voltage measurement. Those tasks fall under the NFPA 70E and in order to perform such tasks safely, in accordance with the NFPA 70E, the requirements must be met. I would also speculate that unless one is putting their face in a 400 amp, service equipment panel, the typical HI doesn?t place themselves in harm?s way too often and the threat of a serious arc blast is negligible. To answer your question more specifically, when will an HI see an Arc Blast? When murphey?s law comes into play and the metallic cover hits a 480/277 VAC panel bus as it slips out of the HI?s hands. Mr. Kenney, to respond to your post, if you thoroughly read the document, you would see that I never suggested that the HI?s level of activity never exceeds a category 0. In fact, I gave an example of when it would be a category 1. I would imply however, that HI?s task probably wouldn?t exceed a category 1; but really not sure. And if I might add, just as some advice, the PDF file link for the NFPA 70E, might be considered a copyright infringement. In fact, by placing such PDF on this site, I?m almost certain it is considered as such. I know this because have worked with the NFPA with copyright issues for our publications at my job and have knowledge on how the copyright process works. Just FYI, don?t want to see you being sued. Mr. Carson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lamb Posted October 9, 2013 Report Share Posted October 9, 2013 If I may respond. Agreed Mr. Lamb, the document does seem boring if you will. I suppose I could have written it as a suspense novel, but the topic is technical and it would have taken more time to write as a novel. (Jesting of course). To answer your question more specifically, when will an HI see an Arc Blast? When murphey?s law comes into play and the metallic cover hits a 480/277 VAC panel bus as it slips out of the HI?s hands. Mr. Carson Thanks for taking the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kogel Posted October 11, 2013 Report Share Posted October 11, 2013 There is nothing boring about the arc fault, so that part is good, IMO. I for one never put any tool, object or finger into the panel enclosure. One inspector i know uses a wooden chopstick to push wires around. In my area we are not permitted to work in a panel unless licensed as an electrician. So the only measurement I will do is at a receptacle or exposed wire outside of the panel box. I do put glasses on before I start on the cover. and I get nervous standing on concrete in socks when I do that. I'll go get my shoes for the panel in the garage. Just feels better to me to be standing on rubber with glasses on. Fumbling with short screws can't be easy with rubber gloves on. Haven't tried the gloves yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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