Training for Tainted Drywall ?

[Nolan Kienitz]

I've hesitated in posting this URL for the training being offered, but I've been in-undated with e-mails from Mr. Battarbee (insurance rep) advertising this two-day seminar in Central Texas.

I've dug into the speakers and other verbiage about the seminar and have found that the speakers appear to be linked at the hip in some fashion or another ... mostly out of Florida.

I've done other searches trying to find solid support for some of the claims being made in the advertising. IE: "Tainted Corrosive “Chineseâ€

[hausdok]

Hi Nolan,

I'd suggest changing the name on your link. There is actually a firm with that name that has nothing to do with the training offered.

OT - OF!!!

M.

[Marc]

One of the presenters at this training has been convicted of fraud to the tune of $1.68 Mil. I had enough of this with the Kramer-folk. Won't be going.

Fraud

Marc

[Nolan Kienitz]

Marc,

Tnx much. That find was very helpful.

I'm tired of the "stuff" as well.

[kurt]

Yeah, good link. Thanx.

What a maroon......

[Construction-Guru]

Nolan and Marc,

While I appreciate your frankness and facts, I'm obligated to answer your issues raised and opinions.

1) Yes, Mr. Martin has been convicted, severed his time, and trying to be a good consumer advocate, on some level, and also trying to educate consumers ... that is something you have to admit.

2) Condemning the whole Tainted Corrosive Drywall Seminar, based on one 50 minute presentation of a (2) two day educational seminar concerning this issue and what specifically the Obama Administration continues to ignore ... is very short sighted and ignorant in itself, unless you feel Mr. Obama has handled the issue correctly ... then we really have a personality and political issue.

3) Texas is the only state, other than Florida that had and continues to have the largest "HOUSING BOOM" ... period.

4) Texas and Florida have the same national builders or developers participating in this "BOOM".

5) Corporate America has no state boundaries, and what these builders, suppliers, developers, and contractors did in Florida, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, Alabama, Mississippi, and numerous other states, with confirmed CDW or TCDW, also happened in TEXAS.

6) You can be a NIMBY (not in my back yard) but facts are facts, and CDW or TCDW has and continues to be found in Texas and actually something most other states only found in small amounts ... un-mark drywall or "blanks" as they have become known.

7) Based on Port shipping records ... TEXAS got TCDW or CDW ... period.

"Blanks" are believed to be coming into Texas by truck and are "Blanks" due to Mexican laws, concerning Chinese imports, but then again, when has the Mexican Government stopped corruption ... Drugs are a prime example of Mexico's inability to in-force laws and tariffs.

9) Please remember this Seminar is EDUCATIONAL and INFORMATIVE and due to the subject matter, continues to be a MAJOR ISSUE affecting and infecting houses, condos, and commercial structures not only in TEXAS but throughout the United States.

As the author and main presenter of this Seminar, I invite you to become informed and educated, before you condemn something you obviously know very little about.

Please call or e-mail me any time ...

Michael S. Foreman

Foreman and Associates, Inc.

Forensic Construction Consultants

http://www.ConstructionGuru.com

[Construction-Guru]

Nolan and Marc,

While I appreciate your frankness and facts, I'm obligated to answer your issues raised and opinions.

1) Yes, Mr. Martin has been convicted, severed his time, and trying to be a good consumer advocate, on some level, and also trying to educate consumers ... that is something you have to admit.

2) Condemning the whole Tainted Corrosive Drywall Seminar, based on one 50 minute presentation of a (2) two day educational seminar concerning this issue and what specifically the Obama Administration continues to ignore ... is very short sighted and ignorant in itself, unless you feel Mr. Obama has handled the issue correctly ... then we really have a personality and political issue.

3) Texas is the only state, other than Florida that had and continues to have the largest "HOUSING BOOM" ... period.

4) Texas and Florida have the same national builders or developers participating in this "BOOM".

5) Corporate America has no state boundaries, and what these builders, suppliers, developers, and contractors did in Florida, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, Alabama, Mississippi, and numerous other states, with confirmed CDW or TCDW, also happened in TEXAS.

6) You can be a NIMBY (not in my back yard) but facts are facts, and CDW or TCDW has and continues to be found in Texas and actually something most other states only found in small amounts ... un-mark drywall or "blanks" as they have become known.

7) Based on Port shipping records ... TEXAS got TCDW or CDW ... period.

"Blanks" are believed to be coming into Texas by truck and are "Blanks" due to Mexican laws, concerning Chinese imports, but then again, when has the Mexican Government stopped corruption ... Drugs are a prime example of Mexico's inability to in-force laws and tariffs.

9) Please remember this Seminar is EDUCATIONAL and INFORMATIVE and due to the subject matter, continues to be a MAJOR ISSUE affecting and infecting houses, condos, and commercial structures not only in TEXAS but throughout the United States.

As the author and main presenter of this Seminar, I invite you to become informed and educated, before you condemn something you obviously know very little about.

Please call or e-mail me any time ...

Michael S. Foreman

Foreman and Associates, Inc.

Forensic Construction Consultants

http://www.ConstructionGuru.com

[Marc]

1) Yes, Mr. Martin has been convicted, severed his time, and trying to be a good consumer advocate, on some level, and also trying to educate consumers ... that is something you have to admit.

No, I don't. It could be 100% financially motivated, as before.

The claims of TCDW might well be valid, but the inclusion into the line up of a presenter with a record of fraud ruins my trust in the entire program. I don't want to take the chance of being mis-informed.

I'll update my understanding on TCDW elsewhere, thank you.

Marc

[Bain]

Go, Marc . . .

[Nolan Kienitz]

I entirely agree with Marc.

The purported claims made in the advertising are quite suspect as there is not quantifiable evidence provided with the claims to back up same.

Not to say that they are not available, but where?

I'm not for one second discounting the potential problems with problem drywall and I will agree with you education is key and relevant; but the verbiage used for this education runs on the edge (any possibly beyond) of being hype.

Your reply comments about housing construction and a "BOOM" in Texas is, candidly, along the lines of the two-day seminar 'hype'.

New home construction and existing home sales in Texas is definitely not in a "BOOM" cycle. Granted Texas has not been hit as bad as many other states, but it is still not what you are labeling as a "BOOM".

[Les]

Mr. Foreman,

Read your opening page on your site and now am certain this may more hype than usual. I read there is fifty years of construction experience and ten years of experience with tainted corrosive drywall. Does not make sense to a careful reader.

I also note you offer remediation services and a "special" protocol.

I am not trying to be ignorant. I am trying to give you an objective look as well as see what the soup of the day is in the toxic building world.

I am with Marc, for now.

[Les]

Mr. Foreman,

Read your opening page on your site and now am certain this may more hype than usual. I read there is fifty years of construction experience and ten years of experience with tainted corrosive drywall. Does not make sense to a careful reader.

I also note you offer remediation services and a "special" protocol.

I am not trying to be ignorant. I am trying to give you an objective look as well as see what the soup of the day is in the toxic building world.

I am with Marc, for now.

Are you really in partnership with The ASHI School?

[Construction-Guru]

Just to be clear ...

Mr. Martin will not be compensated and actually refused compensation except partial transportation expenses.

Yes, Texas has suffered during these economic times, but still leads the Country with new home starts and sales, maybe not a "BOOM" to some but clearly way ahead of the curve ... CONGRATULATION TO TEXAS !!!

Thanks for the opinions and comments on our statistical information, but as with any statistical information, margin of error applies, and even if we are 50% off, Texas once again and as always, is the BIGGEST ...

Marc, Just one question ...

Have you ever had a DUI or been a passenger of anyone with a DUI ???

Think about it ... your whole life ... are you sure ???

Do you run checks on everybody, before you ride with them, your wife rides with, or maybe even your children ride with ... assuming you are married, with children ???

Have you ever done business with someone who declared bankruptcy ???

Do you only talk, listen, and socialize with people who are of [:-monkeydthe same opinions, thoughts, and political party as you ???

Think about it ???

Just some food for thought ... try to keep an open mind.

Would really like to meet both of you in San Marcos, if you are in the area, please stop by and say hello ... you do not have to stay for the Seminar, but if you do, keep an open mind, and you may learn a thing or two.

Michael S. Foreman

Forensic Construction Consultant

Consumer Advocate

Tainted Corrosive Drywall Expert

http://www.ConstructionGuru.com

[Marc]

Do you only talk, listen, and socialize with people who are of [:-monkeydthe same opinions, thoughts, and political party as you ???

No. I listened to you, didn't I? Not that I will anymore.

Marc

[escanlan]

Nolan and Marc,

While I appreciate your frankness and facts, I'm obligated to answer your issues raised and opinions.

1) Yes, Mr. Martin has been convicted, severed his time, and trying to be a good consumer advocate, on some level, and also trying to educate consumers ... that is something you have to admit.

I would certainly have to agree with Marc on this one! Not only do I not have to admit anything I certainly would not look favorably on any endeavor that uses the services of a convicted felon, regardless of what the endeavor is and who the person is. One of the rules that any consumer should use is not to turn the other cheek in the presence of one that you do not personally know! That is a good way to get slapped and your pocket picked as you're only asking for it then. The speaker might well have made amends but according to other links and stories it appears maybe the lesson was not learned well?

2) Condemning the whole Tainted Corrosive Drywall Seminar, based on one 50 minute presentation of a (2) two day educational seminar concerning this issue and what specifically the Obama Administration continues to ignore ... is very short sighted and ignorant in itself, unless you feel Mr. Obama has handled the issue correctly ... then we really have a personality and political issue.

Where did this come from? As I read the previous posts I see no reference to Obama (not that I care for him either way)? I also read the previous posts as expressing their opinions on this seminar being mostly hype and not specifically condeming it just on the one speakers felony conviction.

3) Texas is the only state, other than Florida that had and continues to have the largest "HOUSING BOOM" ... period.

Certainly have to agree with Nolan on his comment regarding the supposed "HOUSING BOOM"!

4) Texas and Florida have the same national builders or developers participating in this "BOOM".

5) Corporate America has no state boundaries, and what these builders, suppliers, developers, and contractors did in Florida, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, Alabama, Mississippi, and numerous other states, with confirmed CDW or TCDW, also happened in TEXAS.

What does that have to do with the comments above? Cases of CDW have already been reported in Texas and only the ignorant would dispute it. The comments above are only stating that the CDW class advertisement is hype and fluff that is potentially greatly exaggerating the extent of it.

6) You can be a NIMBY (not in my back yard) but facts are facts, and CDW or TCDW has and continues to be found in Texas and actually something most other states only found in small amounts ... un-mark drywall or "blanks" as they have become known.

Nobody was disputing the fact that CDW has been found in Texas and nobody here has taken a "NIMBY" stance as you call it. However you WEB site advertisement seems to be a great deal of hyperbole and very short on verifiable facts. Also you have done nothing to provide any of that information for prospective students.

7) Based on Port shipping records ... TEXAS got TCDW or CDW ... period.

"Blanks" are believed to be coming into Texas by truck and are "Blanks" due to Mexican laws, concerning Chinese imports, but then again, when has the Mexican Government stopped corruption ... Drugs are a prime example of Mexico's inability to in-force laws and tariffs.

The proper English spelling is "enforce" and not "in-force". Again I have seen no specific disagreements that potential CDW is entering from our Southern border. Not sure where you got that from?

9) Please remember this Seminar is EDUCATIONAL and INFORMATIVE and due to the subject matter, continues to be a MAJOR ISSUE affecting and infecting houses, condos, and commercial structures not only in TEXAS but throughout the United States.

What educational and informative aspects do you have to offer that can not be gained from the CPSC WEB site, and the many others out there now that deal with CDW?

As the author and main presenter of this Seminar, I invite you to become informed and educated, before you condemn something you obviously know very little about.

Here you have displayed a very unprofessional response which is an attack on the intelligence of some very intelligent Inspectors. Add this response, which is an indication of possible arrogance, to a presentation by a convicted felon, and the hyperbole and baseless claims on the advertising WEB site and I would have to wonder what the $350 is actually buying? It sounds to me as if Inspectors will be paying for the privilege of sitting through two days of training where they are expected to sit in awe or they will be attacked as well?

Please call or e-mail me any time ...

Michael S. Foreman

Foreman and Associates, Inc.

Forensic Construction Consultants

http://www.ConstructionGuru.com

I have added comments and questions above in italics. I would have to agree with the others that this is nothing more than hype to sell a course on information readily available on the WEB. However since you are here answering questions I do have some after reading the site the answers of which might help others decide to take your course. I will take these with snippets from the advertisement.

"have assembled experts"

Until this post, and receiving the advertisement, I have never heard of any of the speakers. If I did it was only in passing and certainly not memorable. Other than what is posted on the site what are the specific talents, accomplishments, etc., that makes these speakers "experts"? What criteria was used to determine their "expert" status?

Upon completion of the first two days, you will know the history, dangers, inspection protocol, and be familiar with the abatement process

The CPSC has a whole section relating to the problem of CDW and even has a reference to an abatement method. The CPSC site is http://www.cpsc.gov/info/drywall/index.html and the abatement procedures are http://www.cpsc.gov/info/drywall/Remediation031811.pdf. Those procedures are extreme high level and really say to replace the affected components and keep the area clean of CDW dust, etc. Does this seminar intend to provide a more appropriate, in depth, abatement process that is nationally recognized?

The advertisement continually gives %'s of homes found, etc., etc. For example one states that residential subdivisions have been found in all areas with 30% - 100% of all homes affected by CDW. Percentages can sure sound scary when you say 100%. But will this seminar provide actual numbers and actual developments affected? It is easy to skew numbers with %'s. For example we have many developments that were started and intended to be 1000+ homes but only wound up with 5 or 10 homes in them. The 100% of 1000 homes is sure a lot worse than 100% of 10 homes, isn't it?

During the seminar will you be providing the source of all the claims on the WEB site advertisement? For example a statement was made that "Current conservative estimates suggest infected homes could exceed 300,000 in the Texas". Where did that come from? Will you be providing participants with credible and authoritative statistic sources they can provide potential clients to display the supposed massive problem here in Texas?

The advertisement lists an "NDE Analysis and Diagnosis Certification Class". Who is NDE? Are they a reputable government agency or large nationally known entity that is an authority on CDW? What are their credentials for issuing any certification? This is suppose to be another course/session on top of the $350, two day seminar. How much is that suppose to cost? What is the link to a syllabus/requirement for the certification and more information on it? Does this certification provide any required licensing or government approval to use?

As part of the seminar you are making reference to ASTM documents. Since these are "Paid For" documents are they being included, in their entirety, as part of the $350 class fee?

Possibly you can answer some of these questions that might well make up the minds of some to attend the seminar?

[Nolan Kienitz]

Manny,

Excellent and detailed response with probing questions.

Thanks for taking the time to review and comment.

[Construction-Guru]

OK, OK, OK ...

One last post ...

I have heard all your concerns about MTM and will take them into consideration.

Obama ... MTM continues to ask what Obama and his Administration will do to help CDW / TCDW victims or Homeowners with the issue.

National Builder / Developers have agreed to correct / repair in their sole discretion, means, and methods, if Homeowners agree to sign away or assign all rights except Health related issue. In return Homeowner gets the Standard (1) one year builder warranty only.

Based on Florida statistics, most infected or affected homes were built by National Builders / Developers.

Please also note, since you all visited my web site ... read the secret Banner Supply / Knauf settlement documents in detail.

Obviously you did not take the time to read Press Releases or other areas of the web site.

Thanks for the grammar lesson ... made note for the future ... again thanks

Seminar provides all or most information, and explains ... example ... ASTM Chamber Testing provides specifics concerning CDW / TCDW out-gassing compounds and specific out-gassing levels, but ASTM as of this post ... has provided NO acceptable or unacceptable levels concerning these compounds ... think about that for a minute ...

You mention the CPSC web site for info ... Great ... Where does that web site or any other web site explain or answer one (1) simple question we have asked, over and over ...

What specifically in the drywall or what specific reaction of compounds is causing the corrosive out-gassing vapors ???

I apologize if you interpreted my answers as arrogant ... as I have never spoke with you, and find these blogs very impersonal, until someone wants to find fault or an excuse to disagree ... point taken.

Thanks for all your opinions and comments, and I strongly recommend you research the issues, with an open mind and not follow as sheep, and think outside the box.

CDW / TCDW is a very complex issue and not very many groups or the Government has answered most of the biggest questions.

Our Seminar explores all these issues and more ...

Please also remember ASTM 1396 section 4.1 "essentially gypsum" term stops CPSC from issuing a RE-CALL, because the product is not Defective, yes ... Tainted and Corrosive, but not Defective.

In reference to the ASHI question ... January 2009 ... I was asked to be the guest speaker, and explain CDW / TCDW, as I had been labeled an expert already, based on my field work and research.

Hope this answers your questions, please read more info, not only on my web site but others.

My firm Consults, we are not performing abatement's, remediation's, and treatment's ... we oversee and confirm compliance with our Protocols.

Thanks for the interest, and again ... sincerely I do respect your concerns ...

Michael S. Foreman

[Tom Raymond]

Not for nothing, one would think a Forensic Construction Consultant would proof read what he writes. Some expert.

[humbleinspector]

Mike Boyette turned me on to your discussion. By tenure, I have spent 2.5 years studying and researching the Chinese Drywall issue. Since is a very evolving issue, I hesitate to say that I am an expert since I believe that no one is as the full breadth of the issue is not yet known including health studies and how to fully remediate it.

However I have had an opportunity to review the course docs (not the cursory ones on the class advertisement flyer) and found them lacking. That is why I declined to back the class. Further I have told Batterbee that I would be happy to help construct such a class. He chose to go out of state...his perogative.

My concern is that the flyer promises are all wrong; there are no certifications for this at all, the mexican connection is not confirmed per Mike Martin although the flyer and subsequent emails say so.

It is not possible to go thru the course and come out a 'DRYWALL INSPECTOR'.

These attendees need to realize that they have to 'keep up' with this evolving story because the last chapter is not yet written. No one knows all the answers and further the 'experts' are arguing about the ones that are 'known'.

The last thing needed is a group of ill-equipped inspectors unleased on Texas homeowners who are already suffering with this really unbelievable malady.

[Marc]

Mike Boyette turned me on to your discussion. By tenure, I have spent 2.5 years studying and researching the Chinese Drywall issue. Since is a very evolving issue, I hesitate to say that I am an expert since I believe that no one is as the full breadth of the issue is not yet known including health studies and how to fully remediate it.

However I have had an opportunity to review the course docs (not the cursory ones on the class advertisement flyer) and found them lacking. That is why I declined to back the class. Further I have told Batterbee that I would be happy to help construct such a class. He chose to go out of state...his perogative.

My concern is that the flyer promises are all wrong; there are no certifications for this at all, the mexican connection is not confirmed per Mike Martin although the flyer and subsequent emails say so.

It is not possible to go thru the course and come out a 'DRYWALL INSPECTOR'.

These attendees need to realize that they have to 'keep up' with this evolving story because the last chapter is not yet written. No one knows all the answers and further the 'experts' are arguing about the ones that are 'known'.

The last thing needed is a group of ill-equipped inspectors unleased on Texas homeowners who are already suffering with this really unbelievable malady.

Q.E.D.

Marc

[Nolan Kienitz]

Mike C.,

Thanks for the additional input.

Here's hoping that the HIs who do spend the $$ to attend ask the right questions and see beyond the hype that appears to be on the presentation agenda.

Like your comment indicates I'm also concerned about the 'newly educated' HIs blitzing their respective markets and creating fear and making mountains out of molehills.

It is all along the lines of the "mold is gold" era from a number of years ago and was just recently addressed on another topic in this forum.

Education is good ... emotion and hype is not good.

[escanlan]

Mike Boyette turned me on to your discussion. By tenure, I have spent 2.5 years studying and researching the Chinese Drywall issue. Since is a very evolving issue, I hesitate to say that I am an expert since I believe that no one is as the full breadth of the issue is not yet known including health studies and how to fully remediate it.

However I have had an opportunity to review the course docs (not the cursory ones on the class advertisement flyer) and found them lacking. That is why I declined to back the class. Further I have told Batterbee that I would be happy to help construct such a class. He chose to go out of state...his perogative.

My concern is that the flyer promises are all wrong; there are no certifications for this at all, the mexican connection is not confirmed per Mike Martin although the flyer and subsequent emails say so.

It is not possible to go thru the course and come out a 'DRYWALL INSPECTOR'.

These attendees need to realize that they have to 'keep up' with this evolving story because the last chapter is not yet written. No one knows all the answers and further the 'experts' are arguing about the ones that are 'known'.

The last thing needed is a group of ill-equipped inspectors unleased on Texas homeowners who are already suffering with this really unbelievable malady.

Mike,

Thank you for stopping in and helping to add more light on the subject. Can you provide any insight into the claims on the RETS advertisement? For example they are claiming that there are Texas developments with 100% of the homes affected and further on to infer an 800+ Lennar and another DR Horton development in S. Austin are affected. Most of the claims on this site are significant but I have not found any "mass" collection of homes affected. I see RETS has removed that claim from their WEB page already. However such large collections of affected homes would have made the news and I just don't see any stories, nor can find any, of such. Are you able to provide any information/links/etc. regarding this?