rbaake Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 I had a client recently inform me that during renovations he had found that cat urine had rusted out some of the electric baseboard heating units in a couple of small localized areas. Of course, they expect me to pick-up the cost. I sited "not visible" and "not readily accessible", which I feel is true (fully furnished home). Anyone handled one like this before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurt Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 Not specifically cat urine on electric baseboards, but similarly inane foolishness. Did the baseboards function? If they were still working but rusted, I'd politely inform the customer I wasn't paying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkenney Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 Just like Mike Holmes you can find all kind of things during "renovations." Renovation means something was disassembled, knocked down, torn apart or accessed in some other way that is not possible during a visual only non-invasive home inspection. Your contract should indicate the extent of your liability. Stick to your guns or you will end up caving every time someone wants you to finance their "renovations." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 'that during renovations'...sounds like renovations were necessary for it to be visible. Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kogel Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 Does he want you to kill the cat, too? [] I will sometimes add a comment that I was unable to verify the function of all the baseboard heaters due to occupany's personal items. Maybe I should add that I was unable to sniff them as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Katen Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 I had a client recently inform me that during renovations he had found that cat urine had rusted out some of the electric baseboard heating units in a couple of small localized areas. Of course, they expect me to pick-up the cost. I sited "not visible" and "not readily accessible", which I feel is true (fully furnished home). Anyone handled one like this before. Depends. If the units were damaged to the point where they didn't work and you didn't test them, then I'd think you had performed a substandard inspection. Unless the heaters were buried in mounds of stuff, you can always turn them on for a few seconds, reach a hand out and feel whether or not they're warming up. In my playbook, it's not enough to use a short phrase like "not accessible" when disclaiming operation of an important system. That calls for a sentence or two explaining why and advising further action. If, on the other hand, they're complaining about rust or some other cosmetic damage that you couldn't see because it was covered by a piece of furniture, then tell them to sit & spin. Also, the word, in this context, is "cited," not "sited." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurt Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 Good points. I always turn them on and reach in or use IR to see if they're working. (I also look to see if there's outlets located above them.) If they work, they work. If they don't, we should know what to do. Simply disclaiming without further explanation begets problems. Thankfully, I rarely see electric baseboards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbaake Posted October 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 Yes, everything working as intended. I always make certain I have several photos of the units (example from todays inspection included below). I think I learned to take these photos from a post on this forum several years ago and consider them priceless when someone calls six months after their inspection and says the heat isn't working. I always include one for the heating and one for AC in all reports. Download Attachment: JouHeat.jpg 58.63 KB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 Yes, everything working as intended. I always make certain I have several photos of the units (example from todays inspection included below). I always include one for the heating and one for AC in all reports. Download Attachment: JouHeat.jpg 58.63?KB Good idea! Think I'll begin doing that. Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbaake Posted October 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 I had a client recently inform me that during renovations he had found that cat urine had rusted out some of the electric baseboard heating units in a couple of small localized areas. Of course, they expect me to pick-up the cost. I sited "not visible" and "not readily accessible", which I feel is true (fully furnished home). Anyone handled one like this before. Good eye Jim. I used the quotes as shorthand referring to the detailed definitions defined in the N.J Standards of Practice and my pre-inspection agreement. This had me thinking. Technically some of the internal baseboard components are visible (I sure a attorney would say), but is any inspector really going to inspect every inch of baseboard in an entire house? Depends. If the units were damaged to the point where they didn't work and you didn't test them, then I'd think you had performed a substandard inspection. Unless the heaters were buried in mounds of stuff, you can always turn them on for a few seconds, reach a hand out and feel whether or not they're warming up. In my playbook, it's not enough to use a short phrase like "not accessible" when disclaiming operation of an important system. That calls for a sentence or two explaining why and advising further action. If, on the other hand, they're complaining about rust or some other cosmetic damage that you couldn't see because it was covered by a piece of furniture, then tell them to sit & spin. Also, the word, in this context, is "cited," not "sited." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Hockstein Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 Tell them you are sorry that their radiator is corroded but that is not part of your inspection. The radiator worked and it is a cosmetic issue. If you want to be a wise ass you could tell them that you only reimburse for dog pee and that cat pee is excluded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hausdok Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 The only way you could have known that the convectors were corroded is by removing the covers from each unit so that you could see all of them. I don't know of anyone that's going to do that; they are often stuck in place with paint or there's so much hair and stuff behind them that if you take the covers off you'll be vacuuming all night. Remind them that you told them before the inspection that they should not expect you to have X-ray vision. (You did tell them that didn't you?). ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottpat Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 Remind them that you told them before the inspection that they should not expect you to have X-ray vision. (You did tell them that didn't you?). ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike And that is why I have in my inspection agreement "I'm not Superman", I then explain that I can not see through walls, underground or predict the future. Everyone seems to under the Superman statement in the agreement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejager Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 It comes down to did you have a contract with the client to find those kinds of problems?; and if you did, did you miss it?; and if you did miss it, did the client suffer an economic loss as a result? Some inspectors are advertising a $5000 home inspection that tests every switch, door, window etc, removes every cover removable, and documents every visible thing in the house. They never sell one, but the client reliazes that what they are getting isn't that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kogel Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Speaking of pee on a heater, sometimes, I just turn up the thermostat and wait for my olfactory detector to pick up the scent of cooking hair and sweat socks. "Yep, there's a working baseboard heater behind the bed". [] I save pics of the junk, too, just in case someone thinks I must have been blind to miss that vomit stain on the wall. On Thursday, I pushed some stuff from the washer to the dryer so I could have a clear workspace. If they have a porch, I set up out there sometimes on my step ladder/desk. Animals. Click to Enlarge 59.75?KB Click to Enlarge 50.55?KB Click to Enlarge 42.9 KB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darren Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 This was from Saturdays inspection. The only reason I saw this was because there was a through wall A/C just above this area. Click to Enlarge 40.67 KB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Simon Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Remind them that you told them before the inspection that they should not expect you to have X-ray vision. (You did tell them that didn't you?). ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike And that is why I have in my inspection agreement "I'm not Superman", I then explain that I can not see through walls, underground or predict the future. Everyone seems to under the Superman statement in the agreement. And I called you to check out my daughters house in TN??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erby Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Speaking of animals Click to Enlarge 53.36?KB Click to Enlarge 56.83?KB Lots of disclaimers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Raymond Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 I can't decide what's scarier: that someone though that was salable, or that someone bought it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hausdok Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Speaking of animals Click to Enlarge 53.36?KB Click to Enlarge 56.83?KB Lots of disclaimers! I'm pretty sure that I've inspected that house a few times. ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!! Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denray Posted November 14, 2011 Report Share Posted November 14, 2011 My mom's house. Click to Enlarge 45.74 KB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neal Lewis Posted November 15, 2011 Report Share Posted November 15, 2011 It seems to me that if the radiator is damaged from cat urine to the point that there's a hole rusted in it, you're going to throw the thing away anyway from the odor! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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