ozofprev Posted April 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2008 [The topic is the ignorant proposal of a stupid law - nothing else.] Very good points, all. WRT this being a bad topic for a "peaceful" board, I disagree. "Peaceful" conversation is rational, and so long as the participants are rational... While it is reasonable discussion for a "peaceful" board, it is not sustainable. I know that. It is not sustainable because just one irrational reply will break it. But that makes this thread no different from threads that have imploded because true believers of one HI organization or another refuse to stop selling their Kool-Aid. Science is part of the foundation on which home inspection is built - so it is important to understand what science is. It is dangerous, for example, to say that a scientific theory is the same thing as a hunch. It is not. The sum of all relevent sciences on the subject has it at something like 4 1/2 billion years. The most popular religion in this country puts it about 6,000 years. Helluva gap in theories. That is NOT a gap in theories. In science terms, that is a helluva gap between a theory and a hunch. No surprise. A scientific theory is based on logic or mathematics. It provides a testable model and is based on the natural, not the supernatural. Science does NOT even attempt to prove the absence of the supernatural, and true scientists are not practicing by their own rules if they state unequivocally that there is no supernatural. So science should not offend believers of the supernatural, although it seems to. Simply: Science has its own rules and language. If someone takes a science course, they should expect to learn its rules in its language. There are plenty of courses on philosophy, sociology, and various cultures. They each have their ways to study, converse and learn. That's the beauty of education. What pisses scientists off is when someone tries to introduce into law something that changes the well-defined rules of its (science) domain. That's just wrong. [The topic is the ignorant proposal of a stupid law - nothing else.] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozofprev Posted April 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2008 Oh, part of the reason I introduced this thread is because it is timely. Friday (day after tomorrow) is the release of Ben Stein's movie "Expelled" The movie should stir much public conversation that is NOT suited for an HI forum. Fun, fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidlord Posted April 17, 2008 Report Share Posted April 17, 2008 I like discussing these topics as long as everyone can stay away from the I'm right your wrong stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozofprev Posted April 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2008 Agreed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghentjr Posted April 17, 2008 Report Share Posted April 17, 2008 Originally posted by kurt I'm not a Christian. I'm a Carpenter...........[:-angel] Don't you mean a Jewish carpenter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Morrison Posted April 17, 2008 Report Share Posted April 17, 2008 I think David's right and Gary's wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Fabry Posted April 17, 2008 Report Share Posted April 17, 2008 I think David's right and Gary's wrong. Now that is funny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozofprev Posted April 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2008 I think Jimmy's right and Chad's an ******. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurt Posted April 17, 2008 Report Share Posted April 17, 2008 Originally posted by ghentjr Originally posted by kurt I'm not a Christian. I'm a Carpenter...........[:-angel] Don't you mean a Jewish carpenter? I've done some work for a Christian law firm (no, that's not an oxymoron), and they really liked it when I hit them w/the "I'm not a Christian, I'm a carpenter" line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Baird Posted April 18, 2008 Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 OK MIke, where's the enforcement arm of this board? Don't you have any jackbooted thugs who can marshal everyone into compliance with the no religion-politics thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hausdok Posted April 18, 2008 Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 Originally posted by Jim Baird OK MIke, where's the enforcement arm of this board? Don't you have any jackbooted thugs who can marshal everyone into compliance with the no religion-politics thing? I'm watching it. So far, nobody has gone viral zealot and begun haranguing anyone else, so there's no reason to don by jack boots. OT - OF!!! M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Brown Posted April 18, 2008 Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 Ahhh... hey Mike the Avatar was a joke ya know... you're not supposed to start liking it! [:-yuck] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Moore Posted April 18, 2008 Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 Originally posted by hausdok I'm watching it. So far, nobody has gone viral zealot and begun haranguing anyone else... Yes, I would like to commend the participants for the reasoned and scholarly way they have pursued this delicate subject matter to date. Our sophisticated membership is fully cognizant that there are differing views worthy of consideration. On this particular subject, like most, I may have my own strongly held opinions, but, as Iââ¬â¢m always open-minded, I feel that the bizarre loonies that disagree with me are fully entitled to their absurd notions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozofprev Posted April 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 Haranguing is a funny looking word ain't it? This thread's pretty much done. People had their say and they did it politely and with humor (except that Jimmy dude - what a jerk). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hausdok Posted April 18, 2008 Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 Originally posted by admin Ahhh... hey Mike the Avatar was a joke ya know... you're not supposed to start liking it! [:-yuck] Joke or not, I kind of like it. OT - OF!!! M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurt Posted April 18, 2008 Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 There's an eerie resemblance...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Posted April 18, 2008 Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 Originally posted by ozofprev Haranguing is a funny looking word ain't it? This thread's pretty much done. People had their say and they did it politely and with humor (except that Jimmy dude - what a jerk). I have not had my say. I just could not figure out how to do it politely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurt Posted April 18, 2008 Report Share Posted April 18, 2008 Why let that stop you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dirks Jr Posted April 19, 2008 Report Share Posted April 19, 2008 What comes first, the chicken or the egg? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian G Posted April 20, 2008 Report Share Posted April 20, 2008 Originally posted by ozofprev People had their say and they did it politely and with humor (except that Jimmy dude - what a jerk). He can't help it. He's from Boston. [:-dev3] Brian G. Like Faulting a Dog for Barking [] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qhinspect Posted April 20, 2008 Report Share Posted April 20, 2008 Originally posted by AHI What comes first, the chicken or the egg? Creation Image Insert: 4.21 KB Result Image Insert: 5.12 KB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozofprev Posted April 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2008 Keeping in mind that the topic of this thread is maintaining the objective practice and teaching of science those interested in the chicken/egg question might see this. Better yet, read some books on biology and biochemistry. Science and objectivity cannot be separated without destroying science. Since science is important to the practice of home inspection, it seemed a worthy topic for a thread. Clearly, a law stating that an "alternate" answer to a science question in a science class is stupid and must be stopped. Equally clear, stating that anyone's beliefs are stupid, or that an individual is ignorant because of his beliefs, cannot be allowed. This is not a thread about philosophy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dirks Jr Posted April 20, 2008 Report Share Posted April 20, 2008 Very very few things are 100% objective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozofprev Posted April 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2008 Seems nothing is pure anymore, but true science strives to be 100% objective. Emotion is its worst enemy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurt Posted April 20, 2008 Report Share Posted April 20, 2008 I'll let others argue the statisitical breakdown. I'm w/the "science is 100% objective" group. Objective proof is empirically driven. It is not based in faith. I keep my articles of faith to myself, unless someone insists on listening to completely obscure cosmologies. So far, few takers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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